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Stones/Mick were in scope to do this? ...from Ian (Read 1,001 times)
Ian Billen
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Stones/Mick were in scope to do this? ...from Ian
Apr 11th, 2009 at 12:10am
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It is strongly reported that Mick purchased the copyrights to the story of The Movie, and book A Clockwork Orange off of author Anthony Burgess in hopes he, and possibly The Rolling Stones could play The Droogie roles, with Mick being Alex Delarge ...of course.

It is also reported Michael Cooper was the one who purchased the copyrights to the story and not Mick. Supposedly Cooper wanted The Stones to do the movie but their schedules never matched up. It is unclear which story is true or what really happened?

Things got into motion, however nothing materialized and Mick/or Michael Cooper supposedly either let the contract lapse or sold the copyrights? A time later Stanley Kubrick moved in and started the movie (with Malcolm Mcdowell as Alex and used other actors as the Droogies) and showed no interest in having The Stones, or Mick, for that matter do it.

*Even Malcolm Mcdowell has said The Stones had it and were on their way in doing the film but it never fully materialized for whatever reason and later he thankfully got the role.

The movie that was eventually created by Kubrick turned out to be nothing short of a masterpiece. An epic tale that is an all time triumph both from a directors/cinematic stand point coinciding with marvelous acting and a story with a strange type of substance to it. Shocking and Bizarre but indeed it's certainly a true classic. A one of a kind film that is undoubtedly in my "top ten" some where.

Does anyone know "if" or how and why Mick lost the copyrights? Also, if everything is true about this story that is so strongly reported why did Kubrick decide on Mcdowell and have no interest in The Stones doing the roles?

*Incidentally, nobody could have did the role as GREAT as Malcolm Mcdowell. What a performance!!
I'm just wondering if there is truth to all this and what really happened there?


Ian
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« Last Edit: Apr 11th, 2009 at 12:23am by Ian Billen »  

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Re: Stones/Mick were in scope to do this? ...from
Reply #1 - Apr 11th, 2009 at 6:38am
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Filming A Clockwork Orange
Extracted from You've Had Your Time: Being the Second Part of the Confessions of
Anthony Burgess, William Heinemann Ltd, London, 1990.


"There had been an attempt, in the middle sixties, to put A Clockwork Orange on the screen, with a singing group known as the Rolling Stones playing the violent quartet led by the hero Alex, a rôle to be given to Mick Jagger. I admired the intelligence, if not the art, of this young man and considered that he looked the quintessence of delinquency. The film rights of the book were sold for very little to a small production company headed by a Californian lawyer. If the film were to be made at all, it could only be in some economical form leasable to clubs: the times were not ripe for the screening of rape and continual mayhem before good family audiences. When the times did become ripe, the option was sold to Warner Brothers for a very large sum: I saw none of the profit... Script-writing can be a relief from the plod of fiction: it is nearly all dialogue, with the récit left to the camera. But it is a mandatory condition of script-writing that one script is never enough. There can sometimes be as many as twenty, with the twentieth usually a reversion to the first. In any event, scripts tend to change radically once they get on the studio floor."

"I knew now that A Clockwork Orange was definitely being filmed - Stanley Kubrick was sending urgent cables about the need to see me in London on some matter of the script - and I feared, justly as it turned out, that there would be frontal nudity and overt rape.

"I knew Kubrick's work well and admired it. Paths of Glory, not at that time admissible in France, was a laconic metaphor of the barbarity of war, with the French showing more barbarity than the Germans. Dr Strangelove was a very acerbic satire on the nuclear destruction we were all awaiting. Kubrick caught in a kind of one-act play, trimmed with shots of mushroom clouds, the masochistic reality of dreading a thing while secretly longing for it... Lolita could not work well, not solely because James Mason and Sellers were miscast, but because Kubrick had found no cinematic equivalent to Nabokov's literary extravagence. Nabokov's script, I knew, had been rejected; all the scripts for A Clockwork Orange, above all my own, had been rejected too, and I feared that the cutting to the narrative bone which harmed the filmed Lolita would turn the filmed A Clockwork Orange into a complementary pornograph - the seduction of a minor for the one, for the other brutal mayhem. The writer's aim in both books had been to put language, not sex or violence, into the foreground; a film, on the other hand, was not made out of words. What I hoped for, having seen 2001: A Space Odyssey, was an expert attempt at visual futurism. A Clockwork Orange, the book, had been set in a vague future which was already probably past; Kubrick had the opportunity to create a fantastic new future which, being realised in décor, could influence the present.

"...Liana, Deborah Rogers and I went to a Soho viewing-room and, with Kubrick standing at the back, heard Walter Carlos's electronic version of Henry Purcell's funeral music for Queen Mary and watched the film unroll... We watched the film to the end, but it was not the end of the book I had published in London in 1962: Kubrick had followed the American truncation and finished with a brilliantly realised fantasy drawn from the ultimate chapter of the one, penultimate chapter of the other... Alex's voice-over gloats: 'I was cured all right.' A vindication of free will had become an exaltation of the urge to sin. I was worried. The British version of the book shows Alex growing up and putting violence by as a childish toy; Kubrick confessed that he did not know this version: an American, though settled in England, he had followed the only version that Americans were permitted to know. I cursed Eric Swenson of W.W. Norton.

"The film was now shown to the public and was regarded by the reactionary as the more dangerous for being so brilliant. Its brilliance nobody could deny, and some of the brilliance was a film director's response to the wordplay of the novel. The camera played, slowing down, speeding up; when Alex hurled himself out of a window a camera enacted his attempted suicide by being itself hurled - a thousand-pound machine ruined at one throw. As for the terrible theme - the violence of the individual preferable to the violence of the state - questions were asked in parliament and the banning of the film urged. It was left to me, while the fulfilled artist Kubrick pared his nails in his house at Borehamwood, to explain to the press what the film, and for that matter the almost forgotten book, was really about, to preach a little sermon about liberum arbitrium, and to affirm the Catholic content. The Catholic press was not pleased. I told the Evening Standard that the germ of the book was the fourfold attack on my first wife by American deserters, and this was summarised on news-vendors' posters as CLOCKWORK ORANGE GANG ATTACKED MY WIFE. Maurice Edelman MP, my old friend, attacked the film in the same newspaper and I had to telephone through a reply. I was not quite sure what I was defending - the book that had been called 'a nasty little shocker' or the film about which Kubrick remained silent. I realised, not for the first time, how little impact even a shocking book can make in comparison with a film. Kubrick's achievement swallowed mine whole, and yet I was responsible for what some called its malign influence on the young."

Burgess then defends the music of novel and film, describing it as "a character in its own right", balancing the benefits of introducing the "pop-loving young" to emotionally stimulating and artistically uplifting music against the denial (more the film's than the novel's) of "the Victorian association of great music with lofty morality." Dining at Kubrick's home, Burgess meets his family and his "concern with music":

"After Alex North had crippled himself with the rushed writing of a score for A Space Odyssey, Kubrick had decided to draw his music out of the existing concert repertory. He set a bad example to some of his followers. John Boorman's Excalibur, for instance, uses music from Tristan und Isolde and Götterdämmerung, whose non-Arthurian associations are blatant. But Kubrick has usually chosen right. I showed him, on his piano, that the Ode to Joy and 'Singin' in the Rain'... go in acceptable counterpoint. I could see the gleam in his eye of a commercial exploitation, but he let it go. What he gave me of value was the idea of my next novel. This was all to do with music.

"I had for some time past toyed with the notion of writing a Regency novel, a kind of Jane Austen parody, which should follow the pattern of a Mozart symphony... I mentioned this to kubrick in a discussion of narrative techniques, and he suggested what I should have already thought of - namely, the imitation of a symphony which already had narrative associations and, for plot, the filling out of the theme which had inspired the symphony. He meant Beethoven's Symphony Number 3 in E Flat, the 'Eroica', which began by being about Napoleon...

"Kubrick was not presenting this idea in a generous void. He wanted to make a film on Napoleon, using techniques denied to Abel Gance, and he wished Napoleon's career to be contained in a film of moderate length. He needed a script, but the script must be preceeded by a novel. The musicalisation of Napoleon's life, from the first Italian campaigns to the exile on St Helena, would be an act of compression, and it would suggest compressive techniques in the film. Thus, if the battle of Waterloo came with Beethoven's scherzo, then the cinematic narrative would be justified in speeding up the action to an almost comic degree. Exile and death on St Helena would have to follow Beethoven's technique of theme and variations - perhaps recapitulated film styles from Eisenstein on - and Napoleon's death would have to be followed by his mythic resurrection, since Beethoven says so. The financing of such a film - with helicopter shots of the major battles, all reproduced in pedantic detail - would run into more millions than A Clockwork Orange had cost, but the film had to be made some day and Kubrick was clearly the man to make it. Meanwhile, the writing of a novel called Napoleon Symphony (the only possible title) would cost only time." - pp. 244-8

"In the film the hero is named Alex Burgess, but only after he has been named Alex DeLarge (a reference to his calling himself, though only in the book, Alex the Large, or Alexander the Great). The cinema gets away with inconsistencies which no copy-editor would stomach in a novel...

"Before embarking with Malcolm [McDowell] on a publicity programme which, since Kubrick went on paring his nails in Borehamwood, seemed designed to glorify an invisible divinity, I went to a public showing of A Clockwork Orange to learn about audience response. The audience was all young people, and at first I was not allowed in, being too old, pop. The violence of the action moved them deeply, especially the blacks, who stood up to shout 'Right on, man,' but the theology passed over their coiffures. A very beautiful interview chaperon, easing me through a session with a French television team, prophesied rightly that the French would 'intellectualise like mad over the thing', but to the Americans the thing looked like an incentive to youthful violence. It was not long before a report came in about four boys, dressed in droog style copied from the film, gang-raping a nun in Poughkeepsie. The couture was later denied - the boys had not yet seen the film - but the rape was a fact, and it was blamed upon Malcolm McDowell and myself. Kubrick went on paring his nails, even when it was announced that he was to be given two New York Critics' awards. I had to collect those at Sardi's restaurant and deliver a speech of thanks. Kubrick telephoned to say what I was to say. I said something rather different."

http://kubricks0.tripod.com/burgesfl.htm
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“What rap did that was impressive was to show there are so many tone-deaf people out there,” he says. “All they need is a drum beat and somebody yelling over it and they’re happy. There’s an enormous market for people who can’t tell one note from another.” - Keef
 
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Ian Billen
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Re: Stones/Mick were in scope to do this? ...from
Reply #2 - Apr 13th, 2009 at 1:52am
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Rocks Off Member "Edith Grove" Posted this excerpt obtained from  http://kubricks0.tripod.com/burgesfl.htm

"There had been an attempt, in the middle sixties, to put A Clockwork Orange on the screen, with a singing group known as the Rolling Stones playing the violent quartet led by the hero Alex, a rôle to be given to Mick Jagger. I admired the intelligence, if not the art, of this young man and considered that he looked the quintessence of delinquency. The film rights of the book were sold for very little to a small production company headed by a Californian lawyer. If the film were to be made at all, it could only be in some economical form leasable to clubs: the times were not ripe for the screening of rape and continual mayhem before good family audiences. When the times did become ripe, the option was sold to Warner Brothers for a very large sum.


______________________________________

Thanks so much for the extra "digging" Edith Grove. This introduces another version of the story. It sounds pretty sensible however it does not explain "IF" The Stones were keen on the idea, or IF they ever started to get the ball rolling with them as the stars, even though it may of not been good timing.

In addition, the article states that when the timing was finally good for such a movie to be made the copyrights were then sold to Warner Bros. and does not tell of why the original owner of the copyrights did not then decide to try and make the film with The Stones if the timing was indeed finally right?

Again, thank you so much for this new facet. I only wish we knew the "why" referring to the fact that the copyrights were sold when the timing was good and "IF" any of The Stones were disappointed in that or cared at all?

..Also ...what was Kubrick's reasoning for the lack of interest with The Stones doing the roles? (not that the film did not turn out simply brilliant without them).

Anyone have any input?


Ian

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Re: Stones/Mick were in scope to do this? ...from
Reply #3 - Apr 13th, 2009 at 8:14am
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Ian Billen wrote on Apr 13th, 2009 at 1:52am:
..Also ...what was Kubrick's reasoning for the lack of interest with The Stones doing the roles? (not that the film did not turn out simply brilliant without them).



I would imagine, if anything, the fact that Kubrick was a cinematic genius and perfectionist would have been a factor in his lack of enthusiasm in hiring a group of musicians with no acting experience whose presence would have probably transformed a potentially explosive and brilliant film into another vehicle a la A Hard Days Night.

Interesting thread, though. I'd forgotten about the story about the Stones buying the rights. Oddly enough, it was shown on TV here the night before you started this thread. Fantastic film.
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Re: Stones/Mick were in scope to do this? ...from
Reply #4 - Apr 13th, 2009 at 8:07pm
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Gazza wrote on Apr 13th, 2009 at 8:14am:
Oddly enough, it was shown on TV here the night before you started this thread. Fantastic film.


Wasn't this film banned in the UK for quite a while?
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“What rap did that was impressive was to show there are so many tone-deaf people out there,” he says. “All they need is a drum beat and somebody yelling over it and they’re happy. There’s an enormous market for people who can’t tell one note from another.” - Keef
 
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Re: Stones/Mick were in scope to do this? ...from
Reply #5 - Apr 13th, 2009 at 9:19pm
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I thought this was common knowledge, from way back. Isn't there a Sympathy For The Devil movie tie in to this?

Pretty sure I read about this in The Unauthorized Rolling Stones book back in the early seventies.
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Re: Stones/Mick were in scope to do this? ...from
Reply #6 - Apr 13th, 2009 at 9:29pm
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fuman wrote on Apr 13th, 2009 at 9:19pm:
I thought this was common knowledge, from way back. Isn't there a Sympathy For The Devil movie tie in to this?

Pretty sure I read about this in The Unauthorized Rolling Stones book back in the early seventies.



________________________


Never heard anything as far as the song SFTD goes but you mention a movie. I think it is reported The Stones got started on Ladies and Gentleman The Rolling Stones when nothing was moving along for A Clock Work Orange..?

Incidentally the eerie and odd music played throughout A Clock Work Orange is a Moog Synthesizer played by Wendy Carlos (formerly known as Walter Carlos...he had a sex change!) doing Beethoven and as well as "Music for the Funeral of Queen Mary" from the 1600's. As well their is some actual Orchestra' pieces in this film.

I never heard or read of of any direct SFTD correlation as far as the song itself goes.


Ian

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« Last Edit: Apr 13th, 2009 at 11:06pm by Ian Billen »  

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Re: Stones/Mick were in scope to do this? ...from
Reply #7 - Apr 13th, 2009 at 9:31pm
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Gazza Wrote:

"hiring a group of musicians with no acting experience whose presence would have probably transformed a potentially explosive and brilliant film into another vehicle a la A Hard Days Night."

_______________________________________


Yes. This is very much a reason I figured he would not of wanted The Stones to do it. Good call by him.


Ian
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Re: Stones/Mick were in scope to do this? ...from
Reply #8 - Apr 14th, 2009 at 6:32am
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I remember reading in the 60's that The Stones were announced to do "Only Lovers Left Alive" but nothing became of it.

The Rolling Stones would not fare well on the celluloid trail—schemes did not come true. We never made a movie-movie, and perhaps it’s just as well. Oh, I went the rounds, made all the noises and we met all the sacred monsters. I first tried to get the rights for A Clockwork Orange, but Anthony Burgess had been, very prematurely, told he was dying and had sold the movie rights to Stanley Kubrick for a tawdry five grand, and Mr. Kubrick didn’t reckon Mick. We settled for a second best novel called Only Lovers Left Alive. And after that too came to naught, the Rolling Stones’ film career was dead.

http://www.gadflyonline.com/best_of_2001/FRIDAY-FILM/film-celluloid-rock.html
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« Last Edit: Apr 14th, 2009 at 6:35am by Heart Of Stone »  

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