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ROCKS OFF - The Rolling Stones Message Board › GENERAL › MAIN BOARD › Dirty Work an underrated album??

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Dirty Work an underrated album?? (Read 4,970 times)

Gazza

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Re: Dirty Work an underrated album??
Reply #25 - Nov 13^th, 2008 at 9:47am

BILL PERKS wrote on Nov 13^th, 2008 at 8:29am:

I'LL NEVER UNDERSTAND GAZZA'S DISLIKE OF HOLD BACK...BACK TO ZERO I CAN UNDERSTAND...BUT HOLD BACK FUCKIN ROCKS-PUTTIN IT ON RIGHT NOW! LOUD!!!

Listening to it now.

Its actually got a good lyric - I'll give it that.

Unfortunately it wastes 3 minutes and 53 seconds of my life rummaging around in vain for something resembling a tune to go along with it, Charlie sounds like he's drumming from Mars (plus it has that horrid 80's sound that has aged so badly), the solo sounds like it was cut and pasted from a different song by mistake and Mick's vocal resembles a mortally wounded dog going through the final stages of rabies.

..and then the intro to "Too Rude" kicks in and we're back on Planet Earth again. THAT's a groove.

PS - I'll quantify my earlier remarks about DW by saying that its a poor Rolling Stones album.

However, a poor Rolling Stones album still batters the best of the work of 98% of other acts into a bloody mess.

« Last Edit: Nov 13^th, 2008 at 9:52am by Gazza »

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Nasty Habits

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Re: Dirty Work an underrated album??
Reply #26 - Nov 13^th, 2008 at 9:55am

Gazza wrote on Nov 13^th, 2008 at 9:47am:

BILL PERKS wrote on Nov 13^th, 2008 at 8:29am:

I'LL NEVER UNDERSTAND GAZZA'S DISLIKE OF HOLD BACK...BACK TO ZERO I CAN UNDERSTAND...BUT HOLD BACK FUCKIN ROCKS-PUTTIN IT ON RIGHT NOW! LOUD!!!

Charlie sounds like he's drumming from Mars, the solo sounds like it was cut and pasted from a different song by mistake and Mick's vocal resembles a mortally wounded dog going through the final stages of rabies.

That is, all in all, an EXCELLENT description of Hold Back.

Your only problem is that you don't think any of that is a GOOD thing. Wink

« Last Edit: Nov 13^th, 2008 at 9:59am by Nasty Habits »

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BILL PERKS Rocks Off Regular Offline Posts: 1,188 NJ	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #27 - Nov 13^th, 2008 at 10:02am Ade wrote on Nov 13^th, 2008 at 9:40am: it's a shite album I ABSOLUTLELY LOVE THE WORD "SHITE" LOVE THE SEEN IN TRAINSPOTTING WHEN THEY ARE TALKIN BOUT LOU REED'S RECENT WORK AND THEY SAY "BUT IN YOUR HEART YOU KNOW IT'S SHITE!" MAY APPLY TO SOME WORKS WE DISCUSS HERE.
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Gazza

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Re: Dirty Work an underrated album??
Reply #28 - Nov 13^th, 2008 at 10:05am

BILL PERKS wrote on Nov 13^th, 2008 at 10:02am:

Ade wrote on Nov 13^th, 2008 at 9:40am:

it's a shite album

I ABSOLUTLELY LOVE THE WORD "SHITE"

LOVE THE SEEN IN TRAINSPOTTING WHEN THEY ARE TALKIN BOUT LOU REED'S RECENT WORK AND THEY SAY "BUT IN YOUR HEART YOU KNOW IT'S SHITE!"

MAY APPLY TO SOME WORKS WE DISCUSS HERE.

In Scotland, 'shite' it's usually interchengeable with the (wonderfully onomatapeic) word "pish" when describing something which isn't very good.

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Zack Rocks Off Regular Offline Chiba Face Rules You Bastards! Posts: 1,727 Dakar Gender:	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #29 - Nov 13^th, 2008 at 10:24am BILL PERKS wrote on Nov 13^th, 2008 at 10:02am: [ I ABSOLUTLELY LOVE THE WORD "SHITE" You are full of shite.
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Joey I Have No Life! Online Posts: 20,290 Omaha , NE Gender:	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #30 - Nov 13^th, 2008 at 10:35am Man looks in the abyss and sees the ' Dirty Work ' album staring back up at him. It is at that point that Man finds his character and THAT is what keeps Man out of the friggin abyss . I remain ........ FOREVER ....... your 'kins ! Joeykins , Est. 1999 and absolutely , ABSOLUTELY loved by EVERYBODY . 'kins
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Some Guy Resident Cretin Offline Posts: 15,837 Atlanta Gender:	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #31 - Nov 13^th, 2008 at 2:30pm I haven't played it in a while, come to think of it I haven't seen it in a while. I asked the dj at a 1987 new years eve party to play it. He did and people danced. I later asked him to play another song from this album and I was dismissed.
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Prodigal Son

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Re: Dirty Work an underrated album??
Reply #32 - Nov 13^th, 2008 at 10:49pm

It ain't very good, but it isn't as wretched as some say. "Sleep Tonight" is ok, though a little too glossy for a Keith song for me to like it. "Too Rude" is too generically reggae, and the production hurts it too (like it does the whole damn album- damn you and your 80s production Steve Lillywhite et. al). The song "Dirty Work" is salvaged by some palpable anger behind it in all aspects. "Had it With You" is sweet grooving and boogying music. The only true killer track is "One Hit," IMO. "Harlem Shuffle" is alright, but the production sucks on it too. "Back to Zero" and "Winning Ugly" are truly terrible though. "Hold Back" is such throwaway as well. "Fight" sounds like a Some Girls outtake. All in all, a C+ rating meaning mediocre but for the Stones unacceptable. It just beats out Emotional Rescue as my least favourite Stones album.

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Navin

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Re: Dirty Work an underrated album??
Reply #33 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 12:34pm

I'm so tired (never bored) of writing about this record as I have done so countless times over the last 5 years on this board alone...and who knows how much and for how long elsewhere and now there seems to be nothing new to add. The sound is out there and it speaks for itself.

Coming to "Hold Back", and this is something I don't remember writing about in particular....the sound is a thick wall of snarl...and 'the wall' aspect is most brought up to the imagination with the lines:

"...If you run with the crowd, yeah, you're going to end up,
end up in the madhouse Shouting those cold walls down..."

This part always 'gets me' and the romantic imagery that I envision for this is being in a madhouse and blocked by stone cold walls - similar to the ones that resemble the walls dripping fluid out of futuristic tubes from the nightmarish dream video for 'One Hit'

And then as I'm trapped in these walls shouting down my primal screams to a crescendo...the drums and the guitar parts towards the end of the song kick in...and now this is the point of transcendence that only the Stones and Dirty Work can promise me...and there really is no other place I would rather be - its also the point of catharsis or release - its a pity when the song fades away, it always seems to fade out sooner than it should - much like the guitar meshing master monster weave on the title track - now that's another story.

A Stones fan since '87, more of a fan of the 80's/90's Era&&&&"Far too pretty to die, well you should have been buried alive"

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glencar Ex Member	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #34 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 3:48pm It rocks! Did then & still(mostly) does. Yes, the covers are great but so are the title track, Had It With You & One Hit.
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twenty dollar me

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Re: Dirty Work an underrated album??
Reply #35 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 4:07pm

i think i listened to this cd once or twice in its entirety when it first came out in 84 or 85, i don't think i've listened to it straight thru since. i remember liking one hit to the body and hold back and maybe 1 or 2 others, but that was about it. there are maybe 4-5 stones albums where i like every song on them, exile and some girs and sticky fingers being 3 of them. mick and keith probably knife fights during this period and it shows on the dirty work cd...hard rocking and nasty.

Nolte - The Rocks Off patron saint

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glencar Ex Member	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #36 - Nov 14^th, 2008 at 4:20pm 1986.
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Zack Rocks Off Regular Offline Chiba Face Rules You Bastards! Posts: 1,727 Dakar Gender:	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #37 - Nov 15^th, 2008 at 1:53pm Can someone please tell me why they needed to bring in Jimmy Page to do the solo for One Hit? What does he do that Keith or Ronnie couldn't?
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Gazza

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Re: Dirty Work an underrated album??
Reply #38 - Nov 15^th, 2008 at 2:02pm

Zack wrote on Nov 15^th, 2008 at 1:53pm:

Can someone please tell me why they needed to bring in Jimmy Page to do the solo for One Hit? What does he do that Keith or Ronnie couldn't?

In short - play the lead.

Ronnie and Keith couldnt get it down the way they wanted apparently, so they needed someone who could.

Its not a coincidence that they stopped playing it live after a few weeks of the Steel Wheels tour - they werent that happy with the way it was working out (personally, I quite liked it..)

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glencar Ex Member	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #39 - Nov 15^th, 2008 at 4:02pm Highlight of the one show I saw on that tour. Tix back then were much tougher to get.
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twenty dollar me Ex Member	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #40 - Nov 15^th, 2008 at 6:35pm the too rude version keith richards and the expensive winos do off of the live at the hollywood paladium is amazing. i think it beats the pants off the dirty work version...in fact i doesn't come close.
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Glimmer Twin Rocks Off Regular Offline Rocks Off Rules You Bastards Posts: 273	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #41 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 12:36am My opinion: Dirty Work is the worse Stones album. Frankly there is very little I like in it. :hilarious
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Gazza Unholy Trinity Admin Offline Rat Bastid "We piss anywhere, man.." Posts: 13,228 Belfast, UK Gender:	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #42 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 4:16am Quote: the too rude version keith richards and the expensive winos do off of the live at the hollywood paladium is amazing. i think it beats the pants off the dirty work version...in fact i doesn't come close. I like 'em both, but I actually prefer the DW outtakes versions. I think thats Ronnie on drums, too.
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axl79

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Re: Dirty Work an underrated album??
Reply #43 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 7:31am

It's a fu**ing depresing album in a depresing time !
Everything is really awfull with the Dirty Work album, the songs, the cover. Mick didn't contribute at all.
He saved the best songs for his upcomming solo project. That's one reason Ronnie got many credits.
I think even Charlie was in a bad shape, that period. Wasn't that his junkie period ???
And Stu fell down dead .

Stoned in Sweden

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Gazza

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Re: Dirty Work an underrated album??
Reply #44 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 8:06am

axl79 wrote on Nov 16^th, 2008 at 7:31am:

Wasnt so much a case of Mick saving songs for an upcoming solo project - more a case of him having just finished "Shes The Boss" and having very little left over. (he didnt start recording Primitive Cool until about 18 months after DW was finished). Then again, having listened to Primitive Cool, its not like he hung on to much in the way of quality.

This was indeed the era when Charlie went over to the dark side. He was also incapacitated for a while during the sessions when he broke a leg in his cellar. Thats why there are other drummers on the record at times - Woody, Anton Fig etc.

Mick flat out refused to tour behind it, citing the poor health of the band ('they werent fit enough to cross the Champs Elysees let alone go on the road'). As Charlie's addiction didnt become known for several years afterwards, no one assumed that he was a problem. Mick obviously got a lot of flak for refusing to tour and was cast as the villain at the time, but with hindsight, the band's health issues plus their poor relationships with each other suggests he was absolutely right.

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axl79 Rocks Off Regular Offline Rocks Off Rules You Bastards Posts: 281 Stockholm, Sweden Gender:	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #45 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 8:46am They acomplish the 76 tour with Keith half death, so why not ? I have heard of a "Biff Hitler Trio" helping on Dirty work, who are they ?
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Gazza

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Re: Dirty Work an underrated album??
Reply #46 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 9:40am

axl79 wrote on Nov 16^th, 2008 at 8:46am:

They acomplish the 76 tour with Keith half death, so why not ?

I have heard of a "Biff Hitler Trio" helping on Dirty work, who are they ?

Keith was generally able to function musically despite any problems he had - thats the difference.

The Biff Hitler Trio (great name!) was, as far as I recall, a sort of band-within-a-band during the DW sessions. I think it was a pseudonym given to a few of the additional crew members who played during the sessions - Alan Rogan, etc. Maybe someone can verify that.

You can actually get Keith 'Biff Hitler Trio' guitar picks on e-bay etc.

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BILL PERKS Rocks Off Regular Offline Posts: 1,188 NJ	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #47 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 9:43am axl79 wrote on Nov 16^th, 2008 at 8:46am: They acomplish the 76 tour with Keith half death, so why not ? I have heard of a "Biff Hitler Trio" helping on Dirty work, who are they ? ALAN ROGAN,CHARLEY DRAYTON,STEVE JORDAN DURING THE NY PHASE OF MIXING
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axl79 Rocks Off Regular Offline Rocks Off Rules You Bastards Posts: 281 Stockholm, Sweden Gender:	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #48 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 10:20am ok, so Steve Jordan is involved here again ... I got this bootleg a time ago but it's 1988 keith solo material.
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BILL PERKS Rocks Off Regular Offline Posts: 1,188 NJ	Re: Dirty Work an underrated album?? Reply #49 - Nov 16^th, 2008 at 10:52am GAZZA ,LOVE THAT AVATAR!! ONE HIT WAS PRETTY GOOD LIVE IN PHILLY IN 89 HARLEM SHUFFLE WAS STELLAR THRUOUT THE TOUR!
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