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Voodoo Chile in Wonderland

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The early days according to Carlo Little
Oct 4^th, 2012 at 11:17pm

Recently "Never Stop Rocking", Carlo Little's widow posted a very interesting testimony by Carlo Little about the early days of the Stones, since she posted it at the "SuperHeavy" thread I'm 100% sure that many of the regulars won't read it (LOL) so due to content from someone who definitively was there during the early day and someone who really played with the Stones I just created this new thread splicing the old one here

This is "Never Stop Rocking" with Carlo and the boyz in Paris, the picture is copyright by Iris Little (thanks again)

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Never Stop Rockin

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Carlo Little
Reply #1 - Oct 2^nd, 2012 at 10:47am

Heart Of Stone wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 2:16pm:

Gazza wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 12:02pm:

Thanks for sharing that. I was just about to scan and upload the article.

But Jesus Christ on a bike, has Mick got a CLUE about the history of the band he's fronted for most of his life?

‘The first ever performance we did was in July at the Marquee Club in London and it was billed as Mick Jagger and the Rolling Stones. It was just me and Keith, Brian (Jones) and a backing band. No one else – no Charlie (Watts), he wasn’t even there. I remember it exactly. I was 19 years old. Ricky Fenson on bass, Carlo Little on drums and Nicky Hopkins on piano. They all told us to **** off when we tried to hire them but it was a big deal getting a gig at the Marquee because it was the hottest London club. It was a jazz club trying to break into blues.

‘The gig was amazing – the drummer was going mad and Nicky was rocking his electric piano and I remember the crowd going absolutely wild. I was thinking as I was singing, they obviously have to book us again, this is the most rocking gig they’ve had in the Marquee ever. But they didn’t. They didn’t let us back in there for ages because rock was working-class, rubbish music. It didn’t exist on an intellectual level like jazz. They saw the future and they didn’t like it. That was our first gig and the people we wanted to get the point just didn’t get it.

Incredible that he remembers 'exactly' the band's first appearance - and gets three of the six band members wrong. Leaving out Dick Taylor is bad enough, but omitting IAN STEWART??

stu watching how stupid we are LOL

Actually he did mention Dick Taylor in that video interview, but again he didn't mention Ian ever!! seems to me he doesn't care for anything from the past, & doesn't give people who started The Stones, Brian & Ian credit!

The Reason why Mick didn't mention Dick Taylor or Ian Stewart on the very first Stones gig was they weren't there, neither was Bill Wyman. The lineup was Mick Jagger, Keith Richards, Brian Jones, Carlo Little, Rick Brown and Nicky Hopkins. Please believe me, I KNOW.

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« Last Edit: Oct 4^th, 2012 at 11:18pm by Voodoo Chile in Wonderland »

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Edith Grove

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Re: The SuperHeavy Thread
Reply #2 - Oct 2^nd, 2012 at 1:16pm

Never Stop Rockin wrote on Oct 2^nd, 2012 at 10:47am:

The Reason why Mick didn't mention Dick Taylor or Ian Stewart on the very first Stones gig was they weren't there, neither was Bill Wyman. The lineup was Mick Jagger, Keith Richards, Brian Jones, Carlo Little, Rick Brown and Nicky Hopkins. Please believe me, I KNOW.

Just like getting it from someone who was there.

So it was Carlo Little on drums ! Thank You, NSR ! Smiley

Now if we could only get some more pics from this show.

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“What rap did that was impressive was to show there are so many tone-deaf people out there,” he says. “All they need is a drum beat and somebody yelling over it and they’re happy. There’s an enormous market for people who can’t tell one note from another.” - Keef

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Egon Rocks Off Regular Offline LET THE GOOD TIMES ROLLING STONES Posts: 1,931 A Dutchy in Marseille, France Gender:	Re: The SuperHeavy Thread Reply #3 - Oct 2^nd, 2012 at 1:41pm WTF is superheavy?
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Re: The SuperHeavy Thread
Reply #4 - Oct 2^nd, 2012 at 2:47pm

Never Stop Rockin wrote on Oct 2^nd, 2012 at 10:47am:

Heart Of Stone wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 2:16pm:

Gazza wrote on Sep 11^th, 2011 at 12:02pm:

Thanks for sharing that. I was just about to scan and upload the article.

But Jesus Christ on a bike, has Mick got a CLUE about the history of the band he's fronted for most of his life?

‘The first ever performance we did was in July at the Marquee Club in London and it was billed as Mick Jagger and the Rolling Stones. It was just me and Keith, Brian (Jones) and a backing band. No one else – no Charlie (Watts), he wasn’t even there. I remember it exactly. I was 19 years old. Ricky Fenson on bass, Carlo Little on drums and Nicky Hopkins on piano. They all told us to **** off when we tried to hire them but it was a big deal getting a gig at the Marquee because it was the hottest London club. It was a jazz club trying to break into blues.

‘The gig was amazing – the drummer was going mad and Nicky was rocking his electric piano and I remember the crowd going absolutely wild. I was thinking as I was singing, they obviously have to book us again, this is the most rocking gig they’ve had in the Marquee ever. But they didn’t. They didn’t let us back in there for ages because rock was working-class, rubbish music. It didn’t exist on an intellectual level like jazz. They saw the future and they didn’t like it. That was our first gig and the people we wanted to get the point just didn’t get it.

Incredible that he remembers 'exactly' the band's first appearance - and gets three of the six band members wrong. Leaving out Dick Taylor is bad enough, but omitting IAN STEWART??

stu watching how stupid we are LOL

Actually he did mention Dick Taylor in that video interview, but again he didn't mention Ian ever!! seems to me he doesn't care for anything from the past, & doesn't give people who started The Stones, Brian & Ian credit!

The Reason why Mick didn't mention Dick Taylor or Ian Stewart on the very first Stones gig was they weren't there, neither was Bill Wyman. The lineup was Mick Jagger, Keith Richards, Brian Jones, Carlo Little, Rick Brown and Nicky Hopkins. Please believe me, I KNOW.

FIRST I EVER HEARD STU WASNT PLAYING THAT NIGHT.
PLEASE TELL US WHAT YOU "KNOW".
TRUTH IS STRANGER THAN FICTION.

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gotdablouse Rocks Off Regular Offline Rocks Off Rules You Bastards Posts: 1,002 Paris, France Gender:	Re: The SuperHeavy Thread Reply #5 - Oct 2^nd, 2012 at 2:54pm Yeah and Nicky Hopkins in 1963! I though he first played with them in 1967 for Their Satanic Majesties...besides he was a studio musician due to his poor health, why would he have been on stage with them that day?
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Re: The SuperHeavy Thread
Reply #6 - Oct 3^rd, 2012 at 7:00am

At the time of "The Rolling Stones" very first gig, Mick, Brian and Keith were without a drummer or bass player as they were just in the throws of trying to put a band together.
They used to Frequent the Marquee in London where "The Cyril Davies" All Stars had a residency and asked the band if they could fill in for them during their break.
As they didn't have a drummer or bass player Carlo, Rick and Nicky agreed to help them out,the band proved popular with the crowd so the Stones then went out to aquire their own gigs.
Still being without a drummer or bass player Carlo and Rick agreed to help them out at their first few venues, Mick, Brian and Keith paid them more than they paid themselves to try to keep them in the band, Mick even helped Carlo to pack his drums away and load them into the vehicle at the end of the gig.
Brian came to Carlo at the end of one the gigs and asked him if he would be their permanent drummer but Carlo who was a session drummer at the time said he couldn't and that they should try Charlie, he wrote Charlie's number down for him and the rest his history.
This is the TRUE account of what really happened.

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Never Stop Rockin Rocks Off Regular Offline Rocks Off Rules You Bastards Posts: 13 ENGLAND Gender:	Re: The SuperHeavy Thread Reply #7 - Oct 3^rd, 2012 at 8:44am Sorry, I forgot to mention that Carlo, Nicky and Rick were The Cyril Davies All Stars.
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Re: The SuperHeavy Thread
Reply #8 - Oct 3^rd, 2012 at 9:09am

gotdablouse wrote on Oct 2^nd, 2012 at 2:54pm:

Yeah and Nicky Hopkins in 1963! I though he first played with them in 1967 for Their Satanic Majesties...besides he was a studio musician due to his poor health, why would he have been on stage with them that day?

from Wikipedia:

"Hopkins' studies were interrupted in 1960 when he left school at 16 to became the pianist with Screaming Lord Sutch's Savages until, two years later, he and fellow Savages Bernie Watson, Rick Brown (Fenson) and Carlo Little, joined the renowned blues harmonica player Cyril Davies, who had just left Blues Incorporated, and became the Cyril Davies R&B All Stars.

However he was forced to leave the All Stars in May 1963 for a series of operations that almost cost him his life and was bed-ridden for nineteen months in his late teenage years. During his convalescence Davies died of leukaemia and The All Stars disbanded.

Hopkins' frail health led him to concentrate on working as a session musician. He quickly became one of London's most in-demand session pianists and performed on many hit recordings from this period. He worked extensively for leading UK independent producers Shel Talmy and Andrew Loog Oldham and performed on albums and singles by The Easybeats, The Kinks, The Pretty Things, The Move and The Who. "

Nicky first recorded with the Stones on Between the Buttons, notably on "Cool, Calm, Collected".

I'm not saying he played with the Stones on their first gig. Just throwing out some facts.

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Voodoo Chile in Wonderland

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Re: The SuperHeavy Thread
Reply #9 - Oct 3^rd, 2012 at 12:27pm

Hi NSR! Glad you’re back, thanks for the information… now my comments:

No way Nicky played with them, they had Stu in 1962 as a regular member of the band, in fact a founder member. Nicky and Carlo shared venues as the top act (The Cyril Davies All Stars.) while the Rolling Stones were their opening act. The first time Nicky played with the Stones was in 1966 with Brian Jones for the "Mord und Totschlag" ("A Degree Of Murder") Soundtrack.

Carlo first played with the Stones on December 26, 1962 then three or four shows in January 1963; for the first gig the drummer ANNOUNCED was Mick Avory but he consistently has denied he played, the drummer was Tony Chapman, and according to Keith he was a very bad drummer so they started looking for a drummer, Carlo accepted to play the above mentioned gigs but refused the offer to become a member as he was in the top leagues so he recommended Charlie who, along with Jack Bruce, were the rhythm section of Alexis Korner

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« Last Edit: Oct 3^rd, 2012 at 12:31pm by Voodoo Chile in Wonderland »

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Re: The SuperHeavy Thread
Reply #10 - Oct 3^rd, 2012 at 5:45pm

Never Stop Rockin wrote on Oct 3^rd, 2012 at 7:00am:

At the time of "The Rolling Stones" very first gig, Mick, Brian and Keith were without a drummer or bass player as they were just in the throws of trying to put a band together.
They used to Frequent the Marquee in London where "The Cyril Davies" All Stars had a residency and asked the band if they could fill in for them during their break.
As they didn't have a drummer or bass player Carlo, Rick and Nicky agreed to help them out,the band proved popular with the crowd so the Stones then went out to aquire their own gigs.
Still being without a drummer or bass player Carlo and Rick agreed to help them out at their first few venues, Mick, Brian and Keith paid them more than they paid themselves to try to keep them in the band, Mick even helped Carlo to pack his drums away and load them into the vehicle at the end of the gig.
Brian came to Carlo at the end of one the gigs and asked him if he would be their permanent drummer but Carlo who was a session drummer at the time said he couldn't and that they should try Charlie, he wrote Charlie's number down for him and the rest his history.
This is the TRUE account of what really happened.

SO WHY WOULDNT STU HAVE PLAYED WHEN HE STARTED THE BAND?

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Re: The SuperHeavy Thread
Reply #11 - Oct 4^th, 2012 at 4:27am

Sorry, but I know the facts only too well.
You see I am Carlo's Widow and we were happily married for 37years until he passed away in 2005.

Carlo often talked about his musical career over the years and I also have his diary's dating from 1961.
You can believe what you want to believe but these are the facts, how can the people who were actually there ( including Mick and Keith) be wrong.

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Re: The SuperHeavy Thread
Reply #12 - Oct 4^th, 2012 at 5:05am

Never Stop Rockin wrote on Oct 4^th, 2012 at 4:27am:

Sorry, but I know the facts only too well.
You see I am Carlo's Widow and we were happily married for 37years until he passed away in 2005.

Carlo often talked about his musical career over the years and I also have his diary's dating from 1961.
You can believe what you want to believe but these are the facts, how can the people who were actually there ( including Mick and Keith) be wrong.

I wish you would post here more. Fuck you Gazza, Will ya?

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“What rap did that was impressive was to show there are so many tone-deaf people out there,” he says. “All they need is a drum beat and somebody yelling over it and they’re happy. There’s an enormous market for people who can’t tell one note from another.” - Keef

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Never Stop Rockin Rocks Off Regular Offline Rocks Off Rules You Bastards Posts: 13 ENGLAND Gender:	Re: The SuperHeavy Thread Reply #13 - Oct 4^th, 2012 at 6:25am Thankyou Edith Grove,I will when there's something to add to. By the Way, I spent some time with Charlie one afternoon last March and he still speaks very highly of Carlo and his drumming.
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Re: The SuperHeavy Thread
Reply #14 - Oct 4^th, 2012 at 7:58am

Never Stop Rockin wrote on Oct 4^th, 2012 at 4:27am:

Sorry, but I know the facts only too well.
You see I am Carlo's Widow and we were happily married for 37years until he passed away in 2005.

Carlo often talked about his musical career over the years and I also have his diary's dating from 1961.
You can believe what you want to believe but these are the facts, how can the people who were actually there ( including Mick and Keith) be wrong.

I AM NOT DOUBTING YOUR ACCOUNT,AND THANK YOU FOR POSTING HERE.
IT'S JUST THE FIRST TIME I'VE HEARD STU DIDNT PLAY, AND JUST WONDERING WHY.
NO BIG DEAL.

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Voodoo Chile in Wonderland

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Re: The SuperHeavy Thread
Reply #15 - Oct 4^th, 2012 at 10:48pm

Never Stop Rockin wrote on Oct 4^th, 2012 at 4:27am:

Sorry, but I know the facts only too well.
You see I am Carlo's Widow and we were happily married for 37years until he passed away in 2005.

Carlo often talked about his musical career over the years and I also have his diary's dating from 1961.
You can believe what you want to believe but these are the facts, how can the people who were actually there ( including Mick and Keith) be wrong.

Thanks so much for all this info, I don't know if your statement (quoted above) was to me, to all or to someone, but PLEASE give me your comments about what I wrote... here it is once more

Voodoo Chile in Wonderland wrote on Oct 3^rd, 2012 at 12:27pm:

Hi NSR! Glad you’re back, thanks for the information… now my comments:

No way Nicky played with them, they had Stu in 1962 as a regular member of the band, in fact a founder member. Nicky and Carlo shared venues as the top act (The Cyril Davies All Stars.) while the Rolling Stones were their opening act. The first time Nicky played with the Stones was in 1966 with Brian Jones for the "Mord und Totschlag" ("A Degree Of Murder") Soundtrack.

Carlo first played with the Stones on December 26, 1962 then three or four shows in January 1963; for the first gig the drummer ANNOUNCED was Mick Avory but he consistently has denied he played, the drummer was Tony Chapman, and according to Keith he was a very bad drummer so they started looking for a drummer, Carlo accepted to play the above mentioned gigs but refused the offer to become a member as he was in the top leagues so he recommended Charlie who, along with Jack Bruce, were the rhythm section of Alexis Korner

Please check the dates on Carlo's diary the dates, probably is NOT July 12, 1962 but later, on December 26, 1962

Thanks in advance

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Voodoo Chile in Wonderland Unholy Trinity Admin Online The Stones are back you bastards!!!! Posts: 17,956 Wonderland Gender:	Re: The SuperHeavy Thread Reply #16 - Oct 4^th, 2012 at 10:49pm BTW... this is too interesting to be in a thread about "SuperHeavy" so I'm going to edit this one and create a new thread
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Voodoo Chile in Wonderland Unholy Trinity Admin Online The Stones are back you bastards!!!! Posts: 17,956 Wonderland Gender:	Re: The early days according to Carlo Little Reply #17 - Oct 4^th, 2012 at 11:28pm On a technical note: LOL this thread extracted from an old one and then spliced onto a new one has 16 replies and only 5 views this is the first time I see something like this
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Edith Grove Rocks Off Regular Offline Disco STILL sucks! Posts: 12,336 New Orleans Gender:	Re: The early days according to Carlo Little Reply #18 - Oct 5^th, 2012 at 5:23am Good idea, Voo. Thanks !
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uncleson Rocks Off Regular Offline Rocks Off Rules You Bastards Posts: 1,169 USA Gender:	Re: The early days according to Carlo Little Reply #19 - Oct 5^th, 2012 at 3:35pm Good thread, just kind of hard to believe Stu didnt play. Goes against anything Ive ever read.
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