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death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria fires (Read 4,721 times)
corgi37
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death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria fires
Feb 9th, 2009 at 6:51am
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At this moment, my state is on fire. I'm metro and safe, but so far, around 130 people have died. Some of the fires are thought to be deliberate. Last Saturday, we had our hottest day in recorded history. 1,000's are homeless. My Great, Great Grandfather came from Oakham, Mass in 1855 or so and settled in Beechworth. Beechworth is the next town that could possibly vanish off the face of the Earth.

Yet there's nothing on here? Lots about fucking baseball and gay Superbowls and Ronnie's Russian slut and people still whining about Obama.
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #1 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 6:54am
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Good to read you're OK, mate. Was thinking about you when I saw it on TV last night. Looks fucking horrible. How close are they to where you are?
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« Last Edit: Feb 9th, 2009 at 6:55am by Gazza »  

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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #2 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 6:59am
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Heartbreaking, Corgi. So little warning for so many folks.
Glad you are OK.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/7878106.stm
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #3 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 7:03am
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Corgi, I SWEAR to you on my way into work this morning, hearing this tragic news on the radio, I IMMEDIATELY thought of you and Deathgod and SIA. A thread would have been started, I assure you

Stay safe and know that you and your Countrymen/women are in our thoughts and prayers!

LJ.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #4 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 7:29am
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Best of luck; stay wet matey!
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #5 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 7:33am
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Dude, glad to hear from you. That looks horrible, arson?
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #6 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 11:31am
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I too was just thinking of you three, Corgi.   God, I hope the wind shifts or it rains or something.  I forget where you all are, so please check in with updates.  SIA and Daeth, you too please. 

Hope this is over soon.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #7 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 11:43am
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Toll up to 166 and arson strongly suspected. Glad to hear  Corgi The King is safe and hope they get this under control soon.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #8 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 11:47am
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That's devastating news from down under - keep safe, will ya!

best thoughts and whishes.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #9 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 12:12pm
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" At this moment, my state is on fire. I'm metro and safe, but so far, around 130 people have died. Some of the fires are thought to be deliberate. Last Saturday, we had our hottest day in recorded history. 1,000's are homeless. My Great, Great Grandfather came from Oakham, Mass in 1855 or so and settled in Beechworth. Beechworth is the next town that could possibly vanish off the face of the Earth. "


Corgi ............................


Our collective thoughts , prayers and well - wishes go out to your family , yourself ,  friends , and fellow countrymen .

Stay Strong Corgi  ....you are The KING !!!!


Hopefully all these fires will be gone by the time The Who come to town next month :

|
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V


www.thewho.com



JACKY !





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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #10 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 12:45pm
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Maybe we in the USA should send them a stimulus package?
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #11 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 3:02pm
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Yes very happy to hear that you are okay Corgi. I am stunned that someone is responsible for deliberatly setting those fires in the first place. I hope that they catch the evil bastards that did this and shoot them on sight! Horrible news! Stay safe brother, and you too SIA and Daeth!



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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #12 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 3:29pm
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Quote:
Maybe we in the USA should send them a stimulus package?



Only you would drag politics into this.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #13 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 3:52pm
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Keep safe, guys! Wildfires are a fucking tragedy.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #14 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 5:02pm
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Dearest corgi37, Stoned in Australia and Daethgod,

I pray for your safety and the safety of your countrymen.  Please check in often.

your friend,

FG
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #15 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 5:16pm
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Quote:
Maybe we in the USA should send them a stimulus package?


Right ON!  that is thinkin glencar Bravo.

Maybe you should be on Sunday mornins!

Terrible Just terrible - Fires

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« Last Edit: Feb 9th, 2009 at 5:18pm by lavendar »  
 
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #16 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 5:30pm
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Glad you are safe, corgi.  Hope the other 2 Aussie guys check in here soon!!
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #17 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 6:22pm
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thanks for your thoughts like  corgi i am a city dweller i so i am ok and fortunately have not been touched by personal loss in this disaster

in terms of loss of life and limb and property this is almost the darkest episode in Australia's history outside of war time*

while some of the fires (at one point there were 13 different fires in corgi's home state) are suspected of having been deliberately lit, as corgi alluded to the conditions have been prime for this to happen - two years of drought and recent heat wave of over 40C temperatures have left corgi's and my States  tinder boxes

some of the stories coming out are simply horrific

unfortunately (much like southern california as i understand ) the risk of these things happening comes with the turf - all that can be hoped is that the risk is managed  as well as possible

the response to the events has been fantastic in terms of people's preparedness to help and most of the fire fighters as well as relief and support workers are volunteers - funny how tragedy can bring out the best in people - but there will, no doubt, be recriminations down the track if not on a "Katrina" scale then at least to the point where there will be some definite changes in attitude and approach to the question of natural disasters generally and bushfires in particular

the dreadful thought is is that there are at least another two months of the "fire season" to get through

* The Victorian bushfire is the worst natural disaster in Australia since 1899, when Cyclone Mahina struck Australia’s northern Cape York, killing more than 400
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« Last Edit: Feb 9th, 2009 at 6:44pm by stonedinaustralia »  

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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #18 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 7:50pm
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I live in a hurricane zone, so I feel I can empathize with those who have to deal seasonal disasters.

It distresses me even more when these events are worsened by the carelessness or ineptitude of other people.

I sincerely hope that our Aussie friends stay safe, and that the persons responsible for the criminal activity surrounding this disaster are punished to the fullest extent of the law.
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“What rap did that was impressive was to show there are so many tone-deaf people out there,” he says. “All they need is a drum beat and somebody yelling over it and they’re happy. There’s an enormous market for people who can’t tell one note from another.” - Keef
 
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #19 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 10:46pm
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I love my Aussie RO'ers! Hope Deathgod checks in soon too. Stay safe, guys.  Sad
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #20 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 10:53pm
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Even though I don't "know" many of you very well, I have really been concerned about, and thinking about, those of you who are dear Aussies and have had these horrible fires ravaging your country and your people. Sad I know how hot it was during the Australian Open, just a week or so ago, so I knew that conditions must have been ripe for a tragedy like this. But then, when I heard of possible arson as well...... Angry Angry I agree. Try 'em for murder and sentence them {if and when they are found}.

Keep checking in with us, please! And I hope and pray that they can contain and squelch the fires soon. No more loss of life, please. Sad:(
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stonedinaustralia
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #21 - Feb 9th, 2009 at 11:41pm
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GotToRollMe wrote on Feb 9th, 2009 at 10:46pm:
I love my Aussie RO'ers! Hope Deathgod checks in soon too. Stay safe, guys.



and i feel confident in saying on behalf of the others that we love our GotToRollMe!  Wink

i am pretty sure Daeth lives in metro Melbourne so he should be ok
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« Last Edit: Feb 9th, 2009 at 11:43pm by stonedinaustralia »  

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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #22 - Feb 10th, 2009 at 12:17am
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corgi37 wrote on Feb 9th, 2009 at 6:51am:
At this moment, my state is on fire. I'm metro and safe, but so far, around 130 people have died. Some of the fires are thought to be deliberate. Last Saturday, we had our hottest day in recorded history. 1,000's are homeless. My Great, Great Grandfather came from Oakham, Mass in 1855 or so and settled in Beechworth. Beechworth is the next town that could possibly vanish off the face of the Earth.

Yet there's nothing on here? Lots about fucking baseball and gay Superbowls and Ronnie's Russian slut and people still whining about Obama.
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/


Please tell us what we can do to help y'all.  Obammie's getting buggered too badly by his own party to help anybody in the US, let alone folks overseas, so maybe we the people of the US could help you without our screwed up government being involved.   Do you need infrastructure stuff like telecom equipment for example?  How about medical supplies?
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #23 - Feb 10th, 2009 at 2:15am
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best wishes to all the RO Aussies - stay safe
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #24 - Feb 10th, 2009 at 7:01am
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Thanks for checking in SIA! Smiley  Glad to know my Aussie friends are safe!
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #25 - Feb 10th, 2009 at 3:42pm
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Caused by Arson!    Who is the (*@#&$(#*7 that would do something like that!


http://uk.news.yahoo.com/4/20090210/video/vwl-thousands-of-australia-wildfire-vi...

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glencar
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #26 - Feb 10th, 2009 at 4:26pm
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There was an arson fire a few years ago that was caused by a woman upset at her husband dumping her. there are many crazy people in the world & they've spread beyond California.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #27 - Feb 10th, 2009 at 4:48pm
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Quote:
There was an arson fire a few years ago that was caused by a woman upset at her husband dumping her. there are many crazy people in the world & they've spread beyond California.


Yeah now their are more than a few in New York.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #28 - Feb 10th, 2009 at 7:48pm
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Rockman posted this pic on IORR. I just had to share it with ya'll.  Cry

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« Last Edit: Feb 10th, 2009 at 8:00pm by Edith Grove »  

“What rap did that was impressive was to show there are so many tone-deaf people out there,” he says. “All they need is a drum beat and somebody yelling over it and they’re happy. There’s an enormous market for people who can’t tell one note from another.” - Keef
 
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #29 - Feb 10th, 2009 at 8:00pm
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Edith Grove wrote on Feb 10th, 2009 at 7:48pm:
Rockman posted this pic on IORR. I just had to share it with ya'll.  Cry

...


great photo.  i saw this on the news earlier this evening.


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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #30 - Feb 10th, 2009 at 8:52pm
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This is such a sad story.  I hope they catch those that atarted this fire and burn them at the stake.
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Reply #31 - Feb 10th, 2009 at 8:55pm
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Extraordinary photo.

Thanks for posting.

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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #32 - Feb 10th, 2009 at 10:42pm
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I saw that photo on the news today. The poor thing....it's paws were burned and he was trying to make his way to safety. Great, touching picture.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #33 - Feb 11th, 2009 at 3:46pm
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Sioux wrote on Feb 10th, 2009 at 10:42pm:
I saw that photo on the news today. The poor thing....it's paws were burned and he was trying to make his way to safety.


well, at least it looks like he found it.  right?
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #34 - Feb 11th, 2009 at 4:40pm
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that picture is amazing.  

They took her (named "Sam") to Southern Ash Wildlife Center where she is recuperating with another koala bear named Bob that was rescued 2 days before.
...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Koala Facts

Koalas rarely drink water, due to their diet of eucalyptus leaves. Eucalyptus leaves contain enough moisture to supply most of the koala's water needs.

Koalas almost became extinct. But due to conservation efforts, koalas have made a comeback. Loss of natural habitat due to logging, residential construction and real estate development, and farming still keeps koalas at risk.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
          ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Sam the Koala wins hearts as emerges from Aussie fire
Today, 06:24 am


Volunteer fire-fighter Dave Tree came across the stricken koala, affectionately named Sam, cowering in a burnt out section of a forest at Mirboo North, some 150 km (90 miles) southeast of Melbourne.

As a colleague filmed him, he approached the koala and offered the terrified animal some water, gently talking until the koala put a paw on his hand and began drinking from the plastic water bottle.

"Things do survive the bushfire. There's a koala here. You alright buddy?" said Tree in the video which was posted on the video sharing website youtube.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XSPx7S4jr4

"This guy has survived. He's looking pretty bewildered."

The koala, who turned out to be female, was taken to the Southern Ash Wildlife Shelter in Rawson while photos of Australia's beloved marsupial, taken on a mobile phone, spread quickly across the globe.

Carer Jenny Shaw told reporters that Sam had suffered burns on her paws and was in pain but on the road to recovery.

The story was reminiscent of another koala named Lucky who survived the bushfires that destroyed about 500 homes with the loss of four lives in the capital of Canberra in 2003.

Lucky became a symbol of hope as people rebuilt lives after the fires and was cared for in a nature reserve, dying recently.

As the fires subside, animals of all shapes and sizes who survived the fires have started to emerge from the charred bushland.

The Australian Wildlife Health Centre at the Healesville Sanctuary, located an hour's drive from Melbourne, has been taking in increasing numbers of injured animals.

But director John Gibbons said so many of the animals were so badly injured that they had to be put down.

"We had a joey today, an eastern grey of about 8 to 10 months old, but we could not save it," he said.

"We expect the workload to increase in coming days as the fires abate and roadblocks are lifted."

Wildlife workers said they had several weeks of hard work in front of them to save as many animals as possible.

Anne Fowler, spokeswoman for the Australian Veterinary Association, said wildlife likely to be affected include koalas, ringtail possums, kangaroos, reptiles and echidna.

"For those animals that can be treated, we treat the wounds under anaesthesia then protect them until they start to heal," she said. "This can take from two weeks to greater than four weeks depending on the severity of the burn."

(Editing by Jeremy Laurence)


The controlled burning of bush and its affect on wildlife has been an issue in the last few years: see

ENVIRONMENT AND NATURAL RESOURCES COMMITTEE
Inquiry into the impact of public land management practices on bushfires in Victoria
Traralgon — 2 August 2007
Chair: Mr J. Pandazopoulos
Deputy Chair: Mr C. Ingram

Ms C. Wood, wildlife carer, Southern Ash Wildlife Shelter.


     The CHAIR — I call the next witness, Colleen Wood from Southern Ash Wildlife Shelter.
     Ms WOOD — I have some photos to hand around, and I warn you that some are a bit graphic.
     The CHAIR — You can hand those over, and we will start looking at them. Because you came in earlier, I will just go through the formal instructions and remind you that all evidence taken at the hearing is protected by parliamentary privilege as provided by the Constitution Act 1975 and is further subject to the provisions of the Parliamentary Committees Act 2003. Any comments you make outside the hearing may not be afforded such privilege. All evidence given today is being recorded, so be conscious of people trying to record you, but also be conscious that people in the gallery are trying to listen to our discussion. Thank you very much for joining us. After your presentation, you might be happy to take some questions.
     Ms WOOD — Thank you. I will just explain who I am. I am a voluntary wildlife carer, and I am licensed by the Department of Sustainability and Environment to rehabilitate sick, injured and orphaned native wildlife. I have informally studied zoology and veterinary science studies and am currently studying wildlife management. I operate the Southern Ash Wildlife Shelter in Rawson.
Flora and fauna have been affected as a result of the 2006 and 2007 wildfires, back burns to contain such wildfires, and fuel reductions. Just under 200 wildlife have been cared for at our shelter, including endangered and threatened species such as greater gliders, brush tailed phascogales, pygmy possums, powerful owls and barking owls. I will note here too that any birds that have come into our care have all had to be euthanised due to their injuries.
I am the leading carer in Victoria dealing with burns. It is a specialised field that needs to be addressed as such. We practise human burns protocol, and burns, as you can imagine, are exceedingly painful. It can take up to 10 days for the actual burns to come out, and we obviously have to deal with the smoke inhalation that these animals sustain too.
As to what comes in, we have a 75 per cent success rate — that is not incorporating what is euthanised out on field — with approximately 80 per cent survival after release. Some 20 per cent of the loss is due to either road trauma or dog attack after release.
It costs approximately $200 to $700 to rehabilitate the animals affected by fire, and that is just incorporating weeks of formula and medical supplies and nothing else. Interestingly enough, our job is classified as a hobby by the taxation department.
We had a brilliant response from the local DSE, which has supported our efforts and assisted with the retrieval of wildlife where possible. The wildlife officers have helped with the search and rescue and retrieval of animals, and particularly with the euthanasia side of things too.
The lack of foliage now out there obviously means there is a lack of feed source. There is no insulation, in particular all around Aberfeldy, because it is just bare. There is a lack of camouflage, and in turn, due to the lack of camouflage, we have hunters in there who are now shooting the wildlife. We are scoring extra business with having to now deal with raising orphaned joeys.
Vehicles such as motorbikes and the like are proving to be a major problem, particularly for those animals that are dispersing into green belts. They are being hit on the roads while they are trying to travel into better areas. Obviously what has survived is now competing for feed and for territory.
The weed species that are starting to establish themselves once again out there are blackberries and fireweeds, and the bracken is fairly much dominating. As natural as bracken is, it absorbs a lot of moisture and in turn robs the eucalypts of vital water sources, although it does provide nutrient to soil and mild camouflage to some of the animals. If it is left for years, it naturally dies back. If it is continually reburnt, the bracken will continue to regreen and in turn rob the soil of the water, and in turn the plants will suffer.
The dry habitat created through continual burning will result in dehydrated animals coming into care, and the ecology will be affected. I am concerned about local extinctions. Some of the areas we are dealing with in the alpine region are obviously renowned for tiger quoll and Leadbeater’s possums, just to name a few. Obviously their habitats have all been affected.
The epicormic growth on the trees — that is, the immature growth — acts as only a temporary food source. It is toxic. It is similar to new immature growth. The mature leaf is needed to maintain the wildlife such as koalas and greater gliders. I in turn have tried to feed some of our guys who have come in from the fires on the epicormic growth, and point blank they will not eat it. They know. The arboreal mammals are my major concern. I feel they will become extinct.
The areas that have been continually reburnt will in turn create a dry habitat, which will in turn make the region more prone to fire. Replanting of areas that do not have eucalypt trees mature enough to seed needs to be done. There is a definite need for that. Long term weed and pest control also needs to be incorporated. In some of these burnt areas obviously you have still foxes and there are a lot of wild dog problems now. If anything, we have seen them move into the township of Rawson and within that vicinity, because there is not a lot of food out there any more. The region affected should be rested. I would state there should be no motor vehicle or motorbike access, and proposed burns should be postponed for several years so flora and fauna have a chance to recover.
Forests and parks used to be closed to public access on high risk fire days, and enforcing this again will prevent accidental fires. The department desperately needs more forest rangers and wildlife officers as well as park rangers who are competent at doing their job to enable effective operations.
The fuel reduction burning in forest regions serves no purpose, and I am talking about lighting up in the middle of the alpine area. We have just proved that with the 100 000 hectares burnt in the 2003 alpine area that has once again reburnt. Habitat trees have obviously been dozered, and many species are dependent on the understorey for survival also, such as ringtail possums. Fair enough, they are common today, but down the track they won’t be. Floods are a consequential result of the fire, and habitat trees along the riverbanks have in turn fallen into the watercourse due to ongoing stress of, firstly, the fire and then the flood. It is obvious; you can see the soil and the silt and branches and numerous things, and I guess any dispersed seed also has entered the waterways, so basically from Aberfeldy debris is flooding out to the East Gippsland area.
I believe in fuel reduction burning to protect private property and townships. However, burning of the ridges should be done, and I have witnessed where the base of a mountain has been burnt in a back burn and it has just ripped through. One of the reasons I think they do that is it is a time thing. It is quick to do it rather than walking it down from the top of a ridge.
Wildlife carers experienced in rescue and with basic wild fire and awareness training need to liaise with DSE and help with the retrieval of wildlife or organise humane euthanasia of wildlife affected by fire. Quite often with the department wildlife is just not brought up. It is slowly coming to be, I guess, but it is imperative that we try to preserve what we have got. There is no evidence, as in documents or data, to support what is practised with the current fuel reduction regimen. Fifteen years is not long enough for a eucalypt to reach maturity and harvest seeds to survive, so I really do not know why that is practised.
Burning inwards from the four corners is quite often what they do when they do a fuel reduction burn. They burn the four sides and burn it in. It is a death trap for animals as well as for people. Mosaic burns conducted in late autumn would be more beneficial for fauna and flora. Worldwide we have wiped out 50 per cent of mammal species and in Australia alone we have wiped out 50 per cent of this. It would be hypocritical of me to save wildlife, particularly those that are burnt, if there is no habitat for them to be released back into. We must maintain a balance. That’s it.
     The CHAIR — To ask you the first question, how many animals would you have treated, say, last year?
     Ms WOOD — I have lost track of them, but it would easily be over 170. I have records at home. There were some that were not recorded because what we do is pretty intense. As soon as we get an animal in, it is basically stop and drop. It is an hour’s worth of treatment, the first day, on that animal with rehydrations, with soaking wounds, with dressing wounds and, in turn, moving on to the next animal. So we get little sleep. It is the decision that if anything is more than 50 per cent burnt and even 30 per cent burnt, ultimately we will opt to euthanase.
     The CHAIR — How do you get funding? How do you pay for your operations?
     Ms WOOD — Initially it was coming out of our own pocket, and it still is, although we have incorporated as Gippsland carers to try to enable us to go for grants to help to subsidise some of these costs, but aside from that, yes, it is a very expensive venture ,and that is probably why I am one of very few in Victoria that actually do it. It is quite costly. I think even during the Moondarra fires, I got up to accounting for, I think it was about at least $7000, with just rehabbing. I think we had through about 130 odd animals then.
     The CHAIR — Your view would be, without putting words in your mouth, that the majority of animals that need care are not being given care because resources are not available or — —
     Ms WOOD — I would say resources were not available. There is also not the education out there too. It is not pushed and in retrospect I guess there are wildlife carers doing the care for the wrong reasons, too. You need a good vet, too. You need good veterinary support to help you to be able to do things, and that is another reason why it is brilliant that we have incorporated as a group, because we have that ongoing support from other carers. You have advice; you have everything out there.
     Ms DUNCAN — Thanks for that. Have you done any research or do you have any anecdotal stuff on the impacts of fuel reduction burns on flora and fauna, and also things like the impact of camping and four wheel driving and those sorts of activities on animal wildlife, I suppose, especially after some trauma to the country like fire? There are two questions there already, and I guess the third one would be: there is a lot of science to suggest that fuel reduction burns are good at preserving biodiversity and have been practised in this country for hundreds of years. Do you not accept that?
     Ms WOOD — I will answer your first two questions. There is not a lot of scientific evidence or people have not researched, particularly in Victoria — in New South Wales they have — the impacts on flora and fauna in relation to the fuel reduction burns on — —
     Ms DUNCAN — Other activities?
     Ms WOOD — Yes, other activities, I guess. It is coming to be now, and that is another reason for networking in with other carers to get that information and to be able to accumulate it rather than it come from one person. Sorry, what was your other question?
     Ms DUNCAN — The final one was about fuel reduction burns as a way of preserving biodiversity.
     Ms WOOD — You know some things in ecology will thrive on that and will overpopulate, whereas you will kill out other things. I know you just said it was for hundreds of years. It has not been for hundreds of years. We have not been settled here long. When the Aborigines were in Australia, there was only 100 000 of them in comparison to 22 million of us, and they never touched the alpine area.
     Mrs FYFFE — I do not have a question for you, but thank you for your presentation and the work you do. I think the one thing that has come across very clearly in every hearing we have held so far is the concern for the loss of wildlife.
     Mrs PETROVICH — I have a lot of questions. First, I would like to commend you for the work you do. I think it would be pretty heartbreaking work. I am an animal person, so I have been quite touched by your photos today. The thing I find quite disturbing in response to the Chairman’s question is about the lack of funding. The first part of the question is: you do not have any establishment funding from government or anywhere when you are setting up your shelters?
     Ms WOOD — Nothing.
     Mrs PETROVICH — No ongoing funding at all?
     Ms WOOD — Nothing.
     Mrs PETROVICH — This is exclusively coming out of the pockets of individuals?
     Ms WOOD — Exclusively, yes.
     Mrs PETROVICH — So do parks have any involvement in the ongoing care of these animals?
     Ms WOOD — I guess in habitat preservation they do, but other than that, it is not part of their job. We are lucky for them to retrieve what they retrieve. So many animals are left out there that are not checked. The pouches are not checked, and the majority of Australia’s mammals are marsupials which have pouches. There is once again the educational process. A lot of these people who work for the department have no idea even on basic identification of wildlife. It is quite incredible.
     Mrs PETROVICH — If we were conducting more of the mosaic burns and burning of ridges, which I think is an interesting aspect of our land management, would we give the animals somewhere to go?
     Ms WOOD — We certainly would, and once again, if it is done in late autumn and allowed to trickle through winter, there will be areas that will be left rather than it being a high intensity sort of burn, which I have seen with fuel reduction burns too. Some of the crews that are placed out there, as much as I guess they are under someone, my personal opinion is they do not have the experience. They are trained in a matter of ways. They are 18 year old guys, and they have no idea, really, and they do not have any backing when it comes to the ecology side effects and what the outcome is to be.
     Mrs PETROVICH — You obviously have a lot of local knowledge and you have spent quite a bit of time, I would imagine, returning animals to the bush. In your experience have there been any studies or investigations into the impact on biodiversity and loss of habitat for these animals since the fires?
     Ms WOOD — Not since the fires, no. There is a PhD student who is actually doing an owl survey at this particular point in time. She has asked me, what is in the alpine area? There is nothing. But on the perimeter, obviously, in the green belt, there is the odd owl, but nothing in comparison to what she had been recording. They certainly have been affected. If you just go out there, there is no sign. Some of your key indications are scratch marks up your trees and, because of the barren soil that is around now, there are no footprints. The other thing we look for is animal faecal droppings, too, to know what is in the area.
     Mrs PETROVICH — You are not seeing a lot of activity?
     Ms WOOD — Nothing, no.
     The CHAIR — I would like to ask you another question. In your submission you have mentioned that the DSE Gippsland staff have assisted with the rescue of native wildlife and that their support has proved invaluable, but you also say that something could be expanded upon. Could you give us a bit more detail about what you think?
     Ms WOOD — It can be expanded upon, I guess.
     The CHAIR — What are they doing? How do they assist you at the moment and what extra things could be done?
     Ms WOOD — Okay, then. I guess Moondarra was a classic example of this, of where it became a bit of a macho thing to retrieve something. I know a lot of the guys looked down on it, like, ‘Oh, why are you picking up the animal?’. We also kept up the feedback in relation to how that animal did. When an animal undergoes fire the first 24 hours are the most critical in deeming whether it will live or not. If these animals can be retrieved fairly fast it gives them a higher chance of success with the rehabilitation side of things, whereas if they are left out there, it is awful.
That kangaroo photo that was going around is a classic example. That kangaroo was still hopping around without fur. The saddest part about it was that even our wildlife officer had problems accessing the state forest area to literally be able to shoot it. Because of the fires he was not allowed in. We had to wait for that roo to come out onto private property before it could be euthanased. That is pretty horrendous. The part that got me about the public, too — a lot of these people who had lost homes — was that it was the straw that broke the camel’s back. They would bring in an animal and it was pretty much up to you and whether you said it would be a goer or not. I like to be honest with people. One woman brought in a ringtail possum and she thought it was dead. That was it; she just broke down. It is a recurrent thing. With that eastern grey roo, a woman had undergone the 2003 fires and then these fires, and with seeing it out there and the stress of having it on her property, that was it — that was the breaking straw for her.
It does impact, and it is something that is just not brought up. People say, ‘We saved the properties, we saved this’, but no one takes into consideration the amount of pain that is inflicted upon our wildlife as a result of it. It is not just about the wildlife being cute and cuddly — yes, they are iconic — but about the biodiversity. These things are here for a reason and if we keep wiping them out, we are wiping out ourselves — not just us, but the generations to come.
     The CHAIR — Thanks very much, Colleen. We very much appreciate that. I remind you that transcripts of the hearing today will be sent to you in the next couple of weeks with instructions. Thank you for writing to us and joining us today.
     Ms WOOD — Thank you.
Witness withdrew.


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« Last Edit: Feb 11th, 2009 at 5:28pm by Tumbled »  

Remember to keep your nose to the grindstone, your shoulder to the wheel, your feet on the ground, your eye on the ball, your ear to the ground, your finger on the pulse, your head on your shoulders, the pedal to the metal, a song in your heart, your hand on the helm and the bull by the horns
 
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #35 - Feb 11th, 2009 at 5:28pm
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informative article, video and picture... tumbled.

Fuck you Gazza, Will ya?
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #36 - Feb 11th, 2009 at 8:46pm
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this is horrific.
its true that in times like these that people step up...
i just can't believe that someone would do something like this inentionally,
i understand natural disasters - they're horrific enough, but this is just unfathomable to me.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #37 - Feb 12th, 2009 at 6:06am
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I'm (oddly) ok. Didnt even lose power. The situation is not over. In fact, could get worse in the next day or so. So far $50mill or so has been raised. I got some friends and peopld at work to donate clothes and such, but it's the odd things you'd never thing about. People donated heaps of canned food (bless 'em), but no one had can openers! Silly little stuff. Now, they got like 40,000 can openers. I feel kinda odd. I am, and my family, is untouched. There's stories of burnt koala's and such. Fuzzy shit. ANd there's guys walking around who have lost their wives and kids. While i worry about my next beer. Some fires are over 100 kilometres away. Some are less than 30. Some fires were deliberately lit! Can you believe that? But what gets me is, some fires have been deliberately lit....again!

The fire front was so fast, that people literally died when they saw smoke. Estimates are that the 1st fire front coverd 20 kilometres in less than 2 minutes. Temperatures reached 1000 degrees in some spots. Many koalas have burnt feet! Axles of cars are now cold, blobs of goop. Helicopter pilots recalled seeing 200 foot Aussie Ash wood trees exploding out of the ground like sky rockets.

There's a hastily arranged telethon on now. Orlando Bloom is here. Megan Gale. I heard Kylie Minogue is arranging someting. Fuck, even the Queen has personally donated. I normally hate the patriotic crap. American, Australian, English, Mexican....what ever. We are all one. I am so sad, yet so proud, of what we've done. Really, lets face it, it's what you'd expect from anyone. I imagine 9-11 in NYC was similar. I KNOW it was here when the Bali bombing happened. Sometimes, nature says "Hey, humans, cop this". Some times, it's ourselves. But always, good people will prevail. ALso, ironically, as we burn, in Queensland, they are under water. Whole towns up there are under water.

My darling friends, fear not. We are made of strong stuff. We are scum, convicts, filth. We are free settlers and immigrants. We are down under, but never down out. We built something from nothing. Some say stole, whatever. We've fought with, and maybe against, some of you. I know so, very many of us appreciate the words fromr the leaders of the nations who frequent here. I say "we", though i am ok. I guess us who are not directly affected feel so warmed by the world response. Yet, i guess, those who have lost feel alone.

We've met hard times. We've beat them. We've become stronger through loss and hardship. We've known what it's like to be down. Not just "Oh, my fucking portfolio is 22% under the mark", but "Fuck! Some cunt is bombing us!".

Dont fret. We are a resilient mob. Even the darkest tree trunk will sprout a green shoot. In a time of need, Australians (and lets face it, all of us) rally together. This weekend, i am up bush. IF i can get through. My sister is ok, but the fires got to a house 3 up from hers. I'm staying with her for the weekend and bringing some stuff up for people who have nothing . Fingers crossed! Many roads are still blocked. The hard thing was, people couldnt go backm, and those trapped, couldnt get out. I'm dreading it, but i might have to help get bodies.

But, ya know, things can only get better.

And, dont laugh, but my bro and i are taking up 10 slabs of beer. Not for us, but for some fire victims and the volunteer fire fighters. Wifey is gonna make a shit load of sandwiches and a few lasagnes. My son gave me some toys to take and my daughter made some "happy" cards (A4 paper with love hearts and glow texta writing on them) and some Barbi dolls to take. And yes, i am taking up some can openers!

I made a promise NOT to play guitar.

Be back in a couple of days. Stay tight and lets get them Stones out here!

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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #38 - Feb 12th, 2009 at 6:28am
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" We are scum, convicts, filth."

Ya'll are OK in my book!  really?
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“What rap did that was impressive was to show there are so many tone-deaf people out there,” he says. “All they need is a drum beat and somebody yelling over it and they’re happy. There’s an enormous market for people who can’t tell one note from another.” - Keef
 
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #39 - Feb 12th, 2009 at 7:03am
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Corgi, you rock.  I'd tell you to have courage, but you're way ahead of me.  Best of luck with the end and the aftermath.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #40 - Feb 12th, 2009 at 7:35am
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stay safe Corgi - best wishes.

good to hear, Sam The Koala is on the mend..... a chink of light, in a very dark time.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #41 - Feb 12th, 2009 at 7:45am
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Damn Corgi, you make me feel like a jerk for complaining about my little troubles.
Thanks for putting things in perspective.

Hang in there and continued good wishes.
LJ.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #42 - Feb 12th, 2009 at 9:15am
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This stuff would test anyone's intestinal fortitude.....You Aussies are a tough bunch of Bastards. Let's go get drunk
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #43 - Feb 12th, 2009 at 9:24am
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Here's to Aussie fortitude! Bless you all.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #44 - Feb 12th, 2009 at 12:12pm
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best wishes Corgi!!  Our thoughts are with you and yours..this is such a sad sad thing

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2009/02/bushfires_in_victoria_australi.html
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« Last Edit: Feb 12th, 2009 at 12:36pm by Tumbled »  

Remember to keep your nose to the grindstone, your shoulder to the wheel, your feet on the ground, your eye on the ball, your ear to the ground, your finger on the pulse, your head on your shoulders, the pedal to the metal, a song in your heart, your hand on the helm and the bull by the horns
 
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #45 - Feb 12th, 2009 at 1:30pm
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When I was a young lad, I read a book about some horrid fires in the Aussie Outback. Can't remember the name of the book or the writer but this week's events are jogging my memory.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #46 - Feb 12th, 2009 at 5:37pm
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how many beers in a slab corgi?

god speed to you out there...do the best you can.

Are you fucking serious?
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #47 - Feb 12th, 2009 at 6:02pm
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i don't  want to appear alarmist but am a little concerned we haven't heard from Daeth.

corgi do you communicate with him on the back channels??

Daeth.. are you out there man??
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #48 - Feb 12th, 2009 at 10:27pm
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I've already posted this on IORR but it bears repeating here:-

I live in Yea, Victoria which is just north of where a major part of the devastation has been, within about 40-50k of it all & where at least 100 people have died, zoom in on the bunch of numbers in the centre of the map to see where I am

http://maps.google.com.au/maps/ms?hl=en&ie=UTF8&msa=0&msid=114253182927958823491...

We haven't been directly affected by fire but it's been uncomfortable close within a semi-circle about 15-20ks around us since Saturday 7th & the air is constantly smoky.

We've had no broadband connection since last thursday (a separate issue from the bushfire) but given the seriousness of the situation we've finally been re-connected so this is my first contact with the world out there.

There are 2 main north-south routes from Melbourne to Yea, both about 1 1/2 hours in length, one through the forest thru Kinglake West,Hazeldean & Flowerdale, this is a beautiful winding hilly drive thru your typical gumtree forest, an idyllic place to live, within striking distance of Melbourne & a lot cheaper to live in, lots are about an acre plus, many folks have horses, strong community spirit & even tho there's about 1000-1500 people per community you wouldn't know it as everyone is spread out from the main road. The other route is to the east & is straighter through Yarra Glen, Dixons Creek & Glenburn, only one major hill to go up at the top of which you meet the forest which goes west towards Kinglake.

We'd been warned about extreme conditions for Saturday 7th, predictions of temperatures in the 40's after a long drought of several years, but I was more concerned with my upcoming birthday on Sunday 8th, my last one in my 50's, the big 60 next year. We've got air-conditioning so we thought we'd be allright. We had an ear to the radio (no net so couldn't keep in touch with the outside world that way). Early Sat. afternoon comes news of a fire in the Kilmore East/Wandong area, this is south-west of us & was the start of the tragedy that was to unfold.

Just after 2pm I took this photo outside my front door looking south-west,  a distance of about 40ks as the crow flies.

...
...


This was what was happening under that smoke cloud

http://media.theaustralian.com.au/multimedia/2009/02/08-rout/index.html..

The fire kept going in a south to south-east direction & then the wind changed to an east, north-east direction & so did the fire.

About 6 o'clock the sky went orange-black & Yea was covered by smoke, this happened within a minute, & about 1000 refugees some from Kinglake & Kinglake West but mainly from Flowerdale which is about 20 mins away flooded the town. This is what my town looked like on what should have been a gentle summers evening, looking roughly in the same direction as the previous photo

...
...

By this time most had lost all they had, all had lost friends & all within the previous hour or so. Here's the aftermath of what they went through in this area

http://media.theaustralian.com.au/multimedia/2009/02/08-mcevoy/index.html

http://media.theaustralian.com.au/multimedia/2009/02/09-rout/index.html

The town swung into action the local Red Cross immediately organising food for the refugees & the CFA (Country Fire Authority), down at the Recreation Reserve which became the Relief Centre, this is opposite the fire station so it's close to the heart of the action & is the staging area for the region. My wife used to be a Chef so her skills have certainly helped in organising the Red Cross kitchen & I've been a Gofer helping out here & there but also talking to the survivors, they've gone thru hell & just need to let it all out, as late as last night they were still needing to talk about it. As Sunday & Monday progressed & we learned how bad it really is, we've been getting more & more supplies into town, tents & beds from the army, clothes from donations, food from Safeways etc. Things have calmed down considerably by today, some of the refugees are starting to make arrangements to stay with friends in Melbourne, our only route out is west via Seymour, the 2 roads south are still closed to all but residents & they are only allowed to go & check the remains of their houses under Police escort, one group went down yesterday to Flowerdale & had to clear the road of a fallen tree & 2 bodies which they discovered only then.It's figured that the ferocity of the fire was so intense that some bodies were vaporised.

As I mentioned, the closest the fire came to us was about 15 k to the south-west, it skirted to the south about 20 k away & is now niggling 20-30 k to the east, they call it the Yea-Murrindindi fire, it settled down last night but it's still there & we're all very aware of it. My wife was talking to the Red Cross co-ordinator this afternoon & it's figured they'll need to keep our staging area active for weeks if not months, she's worked every night down at the kitchen & I've been going over every hour or so to help move stuff, clean up etc. The firemen work 12 hour shifts & change over about 6am when we cook them breakfast, make lunch packs & away they go, upwards of 150 at a time.

There's tons of stuff on youtube about it & the whole nation is stunned. At last count 181 dead of whom about 50 may never be identified given the condition their remains are in, in some cases it's difficult to tell if there are 2 or 3 people together, & 80 or so still missing. I'm living uncomfortably close to all this & at times forget that similar tragedies have occured to the west of us in Bendigo & Horsham, & to the south-east of Victoria in the area we call Gippsland, uncomfortably close to the town of Cockatoo, where I lived for 16 years before moving up to Yea, which was badly destroyed in the last major conflagration we had in Australia, Ash Wednesday, 1983.

Cheers, Rick (vox12string)
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #49 - Feb 12th, 2009 at 11:19pm
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I just read that they've arrested a 39 year old suspect in the Churchill fire! At least 21 people were killed in that one. Sad I hope they catch everyone who is guilty of the arsons that have happened, and I hope they get WORSE than they deserve.
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #50 - Feb 13th, 2009 at 7:35am
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This of course doesn't explain it all, but we have similar problems here in the US due to the build-up of fuel through the years instead of letting small fires burn every year.

http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/green-ideas-must-take-blame-for-deaths-20090211-84...

Quote:
Green ideas must take blame for deaths

    * Miranda Devine
    * February 12, 2009

It wasn't climate change which killed as many as 300 people in Victoria last weekend. It wasn't arsonists. It was the unstoppable intensity of a bushfire, turbo-charged by huge quantities of ground fuel which had been allowed to accumulate over years of drought. It was the power of green ideology over government to oppose attempts to reduce fuel hazards before a megafire erupts, and which prevents landholders from clearing vegetation to protect themselves.

So many people need not have died so horribly. The warnings have been there for a decade. If politicians are intent on whipping up a lynch mob to divert attention from their own culpability, it is not arsonists who should be hanging from lamp-posts but greenies.

Governments appeasing the green beast have ignored numerous state and federal bushfire inquiries over the past decade, almost all of which have recommended increasing the practice of "prescribed burning". Also known as "hazard reduction", it is a methodical regime of burning off flammable ground cover in cooler months, in a controlled fashion, so it does not fuel the inevitable summer bushfires.

In July 2007 Scott Gentle, the Victorian manager of Timber Communities Australia, who lives in Healesville where two fires were still burning yesterday, gave testimony to a Victorian parliamentary bushfire inquiry so prescient it sends a chill down your spine.

"Living in an area like Healesville, whether because of dumb luck or whatever, we have not experienced a fire … since … about 1963. God help us if we ever do, because it will make Ash Wednesday look like a picnic." God help him, he was right.

Gentle complained of obstruction from green local government authorities of any type of fire mitigation strategies. He told of green interference at Kinglake - at the epicentre of Saturday's disaster, where at least 147 people died - during a smaller fire there in 2007.

"The contractors were out working on the fire lines. They put in containment lines and cleared off some of the fire trails. Two weeks later that fire broke out, but unfortunately those trails had been blocked up again [by greens] to turn it back to its natural state
*
… Instances like that are just too numerous to mention. Governments … have been in too much of a rush to appease green idealism … This thing about locking up forests is just not working."

The Kinglake area was a nature-loving community of tree-changers, organic farmers and artists to the north of Melbourne. A council committed to reducing carbon emissions dominates the Nillumbik shire, a so-called "green wedge" area, where restrictions on removing vegetation around houses reportedly added to the dangers. In nearby St Andrews, where more than 20 people are believed to have died, surviving residents have spoken angrily of "greenies" who prevented them from cutting back trees near their property, including in one case, a tea tree that went "whoomp". Dr Phil Cheney, the former head of the CSIRO's bushfire research unit and one of the pioneers of prescribed burning, said yesterday if the fire-ravaged Victorian areas had been hazard-reduced, the flames would not have been as intense.

Kinglake and Maryville, now crime scenes, are built among tall forests of messmate stringy bark trees which pose a special fire hazard, with peeling bark creating firebrands that carry fire five kilometres out. "The only way to reduce the flammability of the bark is by prescribed burning" every five to seven years, Cheney said. He estimates between 35 and 50 tonnes a hectare of dry fuel were waiting to be gobbled up by Saturday's inferno.

Fuel loads above about eight tonnes a hectare are considered a fire hazard. A federal parliamentary inquiry into bushfires in 2003 heard that a fourfold increase in ground fuel leads to a 13-fold increase in the heat generated by a fire.


Things are no better in NSW, although we don't quite have Victoria's perfect storm of winds and forest types. Near Dubbo two years ago, as a bushfire raged through the Goonoo Community Conservation Area, volunteer firefighters bulldozing a control line were obstructed by National Parks and Wildlife Service employees who had driven from Sydney to stop vegetation being damaged.

The poor management of national parks and state forests in Victoria is highlighted by the interactive fire map on the website of the Department of Sustainability and Environment. Yesterday it showed that, of 148 fires started since mid-January, 120 started in state forests, national parks, or other public land, and just 21 on private property.

Only seven months ago, the Victorian Parliament's Environment and Natural Resources Committee tabled its report into the impact of public land management on bushfires, with five recommendations to enhance prescribed burning. This included tripling the amount of land to be hazard-reduced from 130,000 to 385,000 hectares a year. There has been little but lip service from the Government in response. Teary politicians might pepper their talking points with opportunistic intimations of "climate change" and "unprecedented" weather, but they are only diverting the blame. With yes-minister fudging and craven inclusion of green lobbyists in decision-making, they have greatly exacerbated this tragedy.

There is an opening now in Victoria for a predatory legal firm with a taste for David v Goliath class actions.


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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #51 - Aug 6th, 2009 at 5:22am
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One more casualty:  you made a grown man cry

A koala named Sam which became a celebrity in Australia after being rescued from bush fires earlier this year has died during surgery.
She was put to sleep during an operation to remove cysts, after veterinary surgeons found her condition was too advanced to be treatable.
Sam had become a symbol of hope for Australians after the deadliest bushfires in the the country's history.
Prime Minister Kevin Rudd said the 4-year-old koala's death was "tragic".
Sam was found by fire fighters carrying out preventative back burning operations in Victoria state. She was picking her way through the scorched bush on badly burned paws.
Images of her drinking water from a bottle held by fire fighter David Tree were seen around the world.
She was taken to the Southern Ash Wildlife Shelter in Rawson, Victoria, but a few months later was diagnosed with cysts connected to chlamydia, a potentially fatal disease which affects about half of Australia's koala population.
Before her operation to correct the condition, the centre said surgery was "100% necessary" as without it she would die.
'Tragic'
But during the surgery, vets found the condition was more advanced than they had thought and had caused severe changes to Sam's urinary and reproductive tract.

The February fires were the deadliest in Australia's history
"Unfortunately we have had to take the decision to put Sam to sleep," said veterinary surgeon John Butler of the Morwell Vet Clinic.
"She was going to be left in pain in the state she was in and have chronic cystitis symptoms, pain on urination. We had no hope of helping her any further."
Peita Elkhorne, a lawyer representing the wildlife centre, said all those involved with Sam were "devastated with this loss".
The February wildfires were the worst in Australia's history, killing more than 200 people and destroying thousands of homes.
Mr Rudd said the images of Sam being rescued "gave people of the world a great sense that this country Australia could come through those fires - as we have".
"Sam the koala was part of the symbolism of that and it's tragic that Sam the koala is no longer with us," he said.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8186991.stm

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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #52 - Aug 6th, 2009 at 5:26am
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bloody Sad - RIP Sam
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Re: death toll expected to hit 200 + in Victoria f
Reply #53 - Aug 6th, 2009 at 7:06am
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Sad day in Oz re Sam the Koala, even the PM made tribute

http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,25887443-661,00.html

idiot me just stumbled across this thread, was touched to see my Stones buddies were concerned for me and my Aussie mates.

I was actually at a Disabled Surf Training Day on the day. ( we help disabled peeps surf )
It hit freaking 47 degrees, it was so hot the road at the end of my street was melting.

I am a radio announcer and spent the next 2 weeks keeping listeners up to date, and plugging fundraising events and donation drop off points.
the amount of stuff people donated was insane.

Anyways, this thread and Sam the Koala falling off his perch, reminded me of what a short time we have on this planet.
Me wanna make my time a Stonesy one.
stu-smiling
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