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Undercover (some political content) (Read 5,035 times)
TenThousandMotels
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Undercover (some political content)
Jun 27th, 2008 at 6:08pm
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Re: Undercover
Reply #1 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 6:16pm
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undercover extended dance remix Retarded post
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TenThousandMotels
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Re: Undercover
Reply #2 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 7:42pm
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I love that undercover video.....that's kind of what we're doing over in Iraq and Afghanistan today. Terrorizing the population. Keeping them in line. I'll bet they'll be so glad when "we" leave. But who'll protect them if "we" leave. As long as we're there we can protect "them" from "us."  And they need protection from us. Blackwater can provide it for a fee.
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TenThousandMotels
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Re: Undercover
Reply #3 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 7:46pm
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June 27, 2008 
The Yellow Press 
by William S. Lind
antiwar.com

A person my age has watched many things decline in America, and few get better. As one of my neighbors says, everything good is gone or going. In that category we must now include good reporting. When I started work in Washington in 1973, it was axiomatic that a newspaper reporter talked to many sources for any story. The story, in turn, reflected a number of viewpoints and perspectives. No reporter worth his bourbon would have dreamed of just printing some press release put out by the government.

But that is now what they all seem to do, especially in covering the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Forgetting that the phrase "to lie like a bulletin" is military in origin – the reference is to bulletins issued by Napoleon's grande armeé – they print verbatim the happy talk the U.S. military is obliged by the Bush administration to spew. To the degree the war in Iraq is still covered, the American public is assured over and over that "violence is down." For the moment, that is true, but the implication that we are on a roll is not true. Fourth Generation wars do not move in linear fashion. Violence is down because the constantly shifting network of deals and alliances among Iraq's warlords has created a stable interlude. Those alliances will continue to shift, and as they do so violence will rise again. How many reporters are asking the talking-dog majors who brief the press the central strategic question, namely whether there is any evidence a state is reemerging in Iraq? As best I can tell, none. The same number appears to be trying to answer that question from other, more reliable sources.

The reporting on Afghanistan is if anything worse. On Sunday, June 22, the Cleveland Plain Dealer, a paper I like, printed an AP article under the headline, "Marines Drive Taliban From Volatile Province," namely Helmand. The article itself more modestly claims victory in one Helmand town, Garmser. If the 24th MEU has driven the Taliban out of Helmand province, I'll eat my yurt. One town, maybe, but what does taking a town mean in a guerilla war? When the Marines leave, which they will, the Taliban will return.

The fact of the matter is, the whole NATO/American effort in Afghanistan is circling the drain. The American papers should be full of in-depth, multi-sourced stories about the war there. A friend just back from Britain reports that the British press is full of just such stories. In one recent 10-day period, the Brits lost nine soldiers killed, including their first woman. Was that reported anywhere in the U.S. press?

What lies behind the decline in the quality of American reporting? Cutbacks in the size of newsrooms are part of the answer. As the electronic image replaces the printed word, newspapers are dying. To those who know that perceiving reality requires more than shadows on the cave wall, that is bad news.

Lazy reporters are another part of the answer. It is easy to print the bulletins. Reporters have always been lazy, but now their editors let them get away with it. Not too many decades ago, any reporter who single-sourced a story would have been sent back on the street to get more sources, with a richness of invective editors seldom lacked.

But the biggest reason, I suspect, is intellectual cowardice. After the defeat in Vietnam, many supporters of the war blamed the press for our failure. By printing the bad news, the press supposedly undermined popular support for the war and thereby caused our defeat. It's poppycock, of course. The Vietnam War was lost early in the game when MACV, at the demand of Gen. William Depuy, ordered an end to efforts to control the populated coastal lowlands in favor of fighting formal battles against enemy main force units in the highlands. Those units were sent there as bait, which MACV took.

But the American press was scarred by the accusations. Now, it is afraid to be accused of "not supporting the troops" if it does anything but print the bulletins. So the American public gets the mushroom treatment, and two failed wars continue ad infinitum. When the roof falls in both in Iraq and in Afghanistan, the shock will be considerable. America's yellow press will deserve no small share of the blame.


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Re: Undercover
Reply #4 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:05pm
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TenThousandMotels wrote on Jun 27th, 2008 at 7:42pm:
I love that undercover video.....that's kind of what we're doing over in Iraq and Afghanistan today. Terrorizing the population. Keeping them in line. I'll bet they'll be so glad when "we" leave. But who'll protect them if "we" leave. As long as we're there we can protect "them" from "us."  And they need protection from us. Blackwater can provide it for a fee.  


The idiocy that is on display in the above post would be staggering if if came from anyone else but you TTM. Do you even know anyone that has served in Iraq or Afganistan?! That is the most uniformed meanspirited stupid fucking post that you have ever made, and trust me, that's saying something given your history of stupid uninformed posts. Fucking pathetic.


Riffy
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...&&&&...&&&&...&&&&...&&&&"When all government...in little as in great things, shall be drawn to Washington as the center of all power, it will render powerless the checks provided...” Thomas Jefferson&&&&"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have. The course of history shows us that as a government grows, liberty decreases." — Thomas Jefferson&&&&&&&&We're not old men.We don't bother about petty morals--Keef&&&&Actually, it only takes one drink to get me loaded. Trouble is, I can't remember if it's the thirteenth or fourteenth. &&-- George Burns&&&&&&I ain't no leftist!-Bob Dylan&&&&"In the beginning of a change, the patriot is a brave and scarce
 
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Re: Undercover
Reply #5 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:10pm
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Under rated LP.  IMHO.
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TenThousandMotels
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Re: Undercover
Reply #6 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:14pm
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Riffhard wrote on Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:05pm:
TenThousandMotels wrote on Jun 27th, 2008 at 7:42pm:
I love that undercover video.....that's kind of what we're doing over in Iraq and Afghanistan today. Terrorizing the population. Keeping them in line. I'll bet they'll be so glad when "we" leave. But who'll protect them if "we" leave. As long as we're there we can protect "them" from "us."  And they need protection from us. Blackwater can provide it for a fee.  


The idiocy that is on display in the above post would be staggering if if came from anyone else but you TTM. Do you even know anyone that has served in Iraq or Afganistan?! That is the most uniformed meanspirited stupid fucking post that you have ever made, and trust me, that's saying something given your history of stupid uninformed posts. Fucking pathetic.


Riffy


Nope. We got NO business there now. NONE. ZERO. My youngest brother was in Iraq two or three times. As well as being one of the top recruiters for the army in northern New England. My nephew can't wait to go over and slam a few "ragheads".
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TenThousandMotels
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Re: Undercover
Reply #7 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:28pm
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Riffhard wrote on Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:05pm:
[quote author=, and trust me, that's saying something given your history of stupid uninformed posts. Fucking pathetic.

Riffy


Vague generalities. Could you give me some specific examples?


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TenThousandMotels
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Re: Undercover
Reply #8 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:51pm
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BTW....just out of curiosity .... is the US CIA still running death squads in south America now that Ollie and Pinochet are retired? Back in the good old days you just threw leftists out of airplanes in the middle of the Atlantic.

30,000 people "disappeared"

ELIZABETH FARNSWORTH: These women--known as the Mothers of the Plaza de Mayo--have become famous in Argentina because they refuse to forget. Almost two decades have passed since their loved ones disappeared in what is often termed Argentina's "Dirty War." To have "disappeared" in those years--as an estimated 30,000 people did--is almost certainly to have been killed. The Mothers of the Plaza de Mayo want an accounting of what happened to their relatives and punishment of those responsible. The organization has been demonstrating in downtown Buenos Aires every week since just after a 1976 coup brought a military junta to power. Tex Harris was a political officer at the U.S. embassy in Buenos Aires in those years.

F. ALLEN "TEX" HARRIS, Former Embassy Official: For the most part the state terrorist system worked with a kind of numbing brutal efficiency. People were disappeared by what was called the Left Hand. They were tortured for information. They were identified for extermination, and they disappeared.

ELIZABETH FARNSWORTH: The "exterminations" continued until 1982, when Britain defeated Argentina's generals in the Falklands War, and military rule ended. Three years later, Argentina's elected President, Raul Alfonsin, ordered trials of the nine admirals and generals who ruled the country during the years of military dictatorship. Five of the nine were convicted and given sentences ranging from several years to life imprisonment.

But in 1989, Alfonsin's successor, Carlos Menem, the current president, pardoned some leftist guerrillas and the convicted generals and forbade any future trials, saying this was the only way to heal the wounds of the past. Adolfo Perez Esquivel was among those upset by Menem's action. Esquivel had been Imprisoned and tortured in the 70's, and won a Nobel peace prize in 1980 for his non-violent resistance to the military government.

ADOLFO PEREZ ESQUIVEL: (speaking through interpreter) President Menem freed criminals who had been tried and who had not yet been sentenced, which is unconstitutional and violates treaties and international law. So what are the consequences--now--of this impunity? All the criminals are free and some of them hold public office.

ELIZABETH FARNSWORTH: In 1995 this book was published and it added weight to the arguments of those who opposed the pardons. In the book ex naval officer Adolfo Scilingo admits that on orders from his superiors he and other officers dumped "The disappeared"--still alive--from airplanes into the South Atlantic.

ADOLFO SCILINGO: (speaking through interpreter) I participated in two flights. It may be easier than killing someone face to face, but I wiped out 30 sleeping, naked, defenseless people without even knowing what they did and, in fact, now knowing that the great majority never did anything. The use of airplanes--the transfer of the people onto the planes--all the logistics of these flights--I believe only a monster could have designed such a sophisticated killing machine.

Present day problems

ELIZABETH FARNSWORTH: In the two years since Scilingo's confession the movement against impunity has intensified but so has violence against government critics. This demonstration last March commemorated the murder two months earlier of photojournalist Jose Luis Cabezas.

He had been investigating police corruption in Buenos Aires Province for "Noticias" magazine when he was abducted from a party and killed. Then last month four men showing police identification abducted the ex-navy officer Adolfo Scilingo and carved three initials into his face. They were the initials of journalists to whom Scilingo had told his story. Those who oppose president's Menem's pardons argue the lack of accountability for past crimes is partly to blame for these more recent acts of intimidation. Alicia Portnoy was taken prisoner during the 1970's but survived.

ALICIA PORTNOY: If you don't do justice in those cases, this is going to sound very trite, it's been said so much that it sounds trite, but if you don't do justice, this can happen again.


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Re: Undercover
Reply #9 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:51pm
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If you can't see the utter contempt for country and our troops that your meanspirited and completely clueless post clearly shows then there's nothing that I could point to that could make it any clearer for you TTM. It's a classless and tasteless post. It shows a complete lack of knowledge as to what is happening on the ground inside these countries, and it's nothing but disgusting baseless lies. Not to mention that it shows that you seemingly have no problem throwing your own brother's fellow troops, and indeed your own brother as well, under the bus, and describe them all as terrorists just for good measure.

As I said before,pathetic.


Riffy
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...&&&&...&&&&...&&&&...&&&&"When all government...in little as in great things, shall be drawn to Washington as the center of all power, it will render powerless the checks provided...” Thomas Jefferson&&&&"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have. The course of history shows us that as a government grows, liberty decreases." — Thomas Jefferson&&&&&&&&We're not old men.We don't bother about petty morals--Keef&&&&Actually, it only takes one drink to get me loaded. Trouble is, I can't remember if it's the thirteenth or fourteenth. &&-- George Burns&&&&&&I ain't no leftist!-Bob Dylan&&&&"In the beginning of a change, the patriot is a brave and scarce
 
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TenThousandMotels
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Re: Undercover
Reply #10 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:55pm
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Riffhard wrote on Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:51pm:
If you can't see the utter contempt for country and our troops that your meanspirited and completely clueless post clearly shows then there's nothing that I could point to that could make it any clearer for you TTM. It's a classless and tasteless post. It shows a complete lack of knowledge as to what is happening on the ground inside these countries, and it's nothing but disgusting baseless lies. Not to mention that it shows that you seemingly have no problem throwing your own brother's fellow troops, and indeed your own brother as well, under the bus, and describe them all as terrorists just for good measure.

As I said before,pathetic.


Riffy  


It's got nothing to do with the troops or my bother. It's policy. I suppose a good soldier has to not question bad policy.
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TenThousandMotels
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Re: Undercover
Reply #11 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 9:05pm
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http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/General/JohnnyGotHisGun.html

It will be you-you who urge us on to battle you who incite us against ourselves you who would have one cobbler kill another cobbler you who would have one man who works kill another man who works you who would have one human being who wants only to live kill another human being who wants only to live. Remember this. Remember this well you people who plan for war. Remember this you patriots you fierce ones you spawners of hate you inventors of slogans. Remember this as you have never remembered anything else in your lives.

We are men of peace we are men who work and we want no quarrel. But if you destroy our peace if you take away our work if you try to range us one against the other we will know what to do. If you tell us to make the world safe for democracy we will take you seriously and by god and by Christ we will make it so. We will use the guns you force upon us we will use them to defend our very lives and the menace to our lives does not lie on the other side of a nomansland that was set apart without our consent it lies within our own boundaries here and now we have seen it and we know it.

Put the guns into our hands and we will use them. Give us the slogans and we will turn them into realities. Sing the battle hymns and we will take them up where you left off. Not one not ten not ten thousand not a million not ten millions not a hundred millions but a billion two billions of us all the people of the world we will have the slogans and we will have the hymns and we will have the guns and we will use them and we will live. Make no mistake of it we will live. We will be alive and we will walk and talk and eat and sing and laugh and feel and love and bear our children in tranquillity in security in decency in peace. You plan the wars you masters of men plan the wars and point the way and we will point the gun.
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Re: Undercover
Reply #12 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 9:19pm
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TenThousandMotels wrote on Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:55pm:
Riffhard wrote on Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:51pm:
If you can't see the utter contempt for country and our troops that your meanspirited and completely clueless post clearly shows then there's nothing that I could point to that could make it any clearer for you TTM. It's a classless and tasteless post. It shows a complete lack of knowledge as to what is happening on the ground inside these countries, and it's nothing but disgusting baseless lies. Not to mention that it shows that you seemingly have no problem throwing your own brother's fellow troops, and indeed your own brother as well, under the bus, and describe them all as terrorists just for good measure.

As I said before,pathetic.


Riffy  


It's got nothing to do with the troops or my bother. It's policy. I suppose a good soldier has to not question bad policy.



Pathetic excuse of a pathetic post, but if it helps you feel better just keep telling yourself that you didn't disparage the troops when you plainly stated that they were terrorizing innocent Iraqis and Afghanis. I know what you meant, and so does everyone else that is willing to be intellectually honest.


Riffy
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« Last Edit: Jun 28th, 2008 at 8:24am by Riffhard »  

...&&&&...&&&&...&&&&...&&&&"When all government...in little as in great things, shall be drawn to Washington as the center of all power, it will render powerless the checks provided...” Thomas Jefferson&&&&"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have. The course of history shows us that as a government grows, liberty decreases." — Thomas Jefferson&&&&&&&&We're not old men.We don't bother about petty morals--Keef&&&&Actually, it only takes one drink to get me loaded. Trouble is, I can't remember if it's the thirteenth or fourteenth. &&-- George Burns&&&&&&I ain't no leftist!-Bob Dylan&&&&"In the beginning of a change, the patriot is a brave and scarce
 
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TenThousandMotels
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Re: Undercover
Reply #13 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 9:25pm
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Riffhard wrote on Jun 27th, 2008 at 9:19pm:
TenThousandMotels wrote on Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:55pm:
Riffhard wrote on Jun 27th, 2008 at 8:51pm:
If you can't see the utter contempt for country and our troops that your meanspirited and completely clueless post clearly shows then there's nothing that I could point to that could make it any clearer for you TTM. It's a classless and tasteless post. It shows a complete lack of knowledge as to what is happening on the ground inside these countries, and it's nothing but disgusting baseless lies. Not to mention that it shows that you seemingly have no problem throwing your own brother's fellow troops, and indeed your own brother as well, under the bus, and describe them all as terrorists just for good measure.

As I said before,pathetic.


Riffy  


It's got nothing to do with the troops or my bother. It's policy. I suppose a good soldier has to not question bad policy.



Pathetic excuse of a pathetic post, but if it helps you feel better just keep telling yourself that you didn't disbarage the troops when you plainly stated that they were terrorizing innocent Iraqis and Afganies. I know what you meant, and so does everyone else that is willing to be intellectually honest.


Riffy



You should ask them really.
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TenThousandMotels
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Re: Undercover
Reply #14 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 9:38pm
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...


Evening meditaion.
"where do they dig these people up?

...
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Re: Undercover
Reply #15 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 9:40pm
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Terrifying, huh?


...


...


Look at the terror in this poor kid's eyes!


...


I'll bet this kid hates the USA!


...



You're clueless.


Riffy
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« Last Edit: Jun 27th, 2008 at 9:44pm by Riffhard »  

...&&&&...&&&&...&&&&...&&&&"When all government...in little as in great things, shall be drawn to Washington as the center of all power, it will render powerless the checks provided...” Thomas Jefferson&&&&"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have. The course of history shows us that as a government grows, liberty decreases." — Thomas Jefferson&&&&&&&&We're not old men.We don't bother about petty morals--Keef&&&&Actually, it only takes one drink to get me loaded. Trouble is, I can't remember if it's the thirteenth or fourteenth. &&-- George Burns&&&&&&I ain't no leftist!-Bob Dylan&&&&"In the beginning of a change, the patriot is a brave and scarce
 
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TenThousandMotels
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Re: Undercover
Reply #16 - Jun 27th, 2008 at 10:01pm
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Nice. But the occupation is still still illegal.

It is a universal truth that the loss of liberty at home is to be charged to the provisions against danger, real or pretended, from abroad.
James Madison

No nation could preserve its freedom in the midst of continual warfare.
James Madison

The means of defense against foreign danger historically have become the instruments of tyranny at home.
James Madison
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Re: Undercover
Reply #17 - Jun 28th, 2008 at 3:56am
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They say that every picture tells a story...
I guess you just have to pick up the one you like...

...

...

...

...
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So, what's your point?

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Re: Undercover
Reply #18 - Jun 28th, 2008 at 5:14am
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Hey TTM, major kudos to your brother, for serving our country.
Curious, have you ever talked to anyone who had a family member
perish on 9/11?  I was at a corporation this week where walking
out the door was a memorial to 9 who had perished.  Talking to
employees there, there was not one who did not think what is
happening in Iraq or Afganistan was not right.  Furthermore,
they support more action of this ilk in the attempt to irradicate
such filth, that before 9/11, and to this day, is intent upon roasting
our US carcass over a fire of death right here in our country.  In your little
lean-to in Maine.   Your doing well in the copy & paste department with James Madison.
What would Mr. Madison think about our country not maintaining the
proper safeguards which let a band of Arabs take over four airplanes
crashing them into three buildings, and a field, where thousands died.
We should just not do anything?  That these losers could obtain flying
lessons, go undetected at airports, reek havoc as they did, killing thousands of
innocent citizens, because our country pre 9/11 did nothing to weed out
the trash which had infiltrated our borders? 
Enough with the pablum. 


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Re: Undercover
Reply #19 - Jun 28th, 2008 at 8:06am
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"Enough with the pablum."

TTM LOVES pablum! And Barry O'Bama will deliver as much as he likes. YES WE CAN!
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Re: Undercover
Reply #20 - Jun 28th, 2008 at 9:39am
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For some odd reason, I've never really liked that album. Perhaps I should give it another listen to see if it's aged well. Smiley (Or, if I've aged well). Smiley
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Re: Undercover (some political content)
Reply #21 - Jun 28th, 2008 at 5:15pm
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Undercover not so good: 5/10

As for Iraq - I agree we should not be there - from what I've read, none of the 9/11 assholes were from there. Have we found Osama yet??
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Re: Undercover
Reply #22 - Jun 28th, 2008 at 5:34pm
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"  And they need protection from us. Blackwater can provide it for a fee.   "


What the United States needs to do next is invade Iran and spend another four billion dollars a week protecting THAT country .

Why Not ?!   ... It is only money and we can make our nations' children and grandchildren pay for it all   ---- Joey like ( cause HE ain't paying for it  ) !!!!!


" Re-Institute the Draft TOO ,  Ronnie "


JJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJJACKY CAKES !!!!


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Re: Undercover (some political content)
Reply #23 - Jun 28th, 2008 at 7:49pm
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This thread is kinda funny.
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Re: Undercover (some political content)
Reply #24 - Jun 28th, 2008 at 10:26pm
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Politics aside (I side with Riffhard, by the way) Undercover is an excellent song, and frankly under rated.
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