Listen- I do not get it. It is the best song on Hackney Diamonds. It's a ferocious love song. Inclusion in the setlist will sell more Hackney Diamonds, and back catalog sales will increase further. Jagger would show out on this song! Do they not dig it? Is it too hard to play? I am killing it on the BeltLine with this song! Talk to me!

Song of The Summer potential...

https://youtu.be/Vwtd9miqkLg?si=fjJ-5qB5pH5iiasJ

And where precisely is/how Elton John featured?

I agree, drop Angry, it sucks live and give us literally ANY other song off of HD, but preferably Get Close or maybe Depending on You ..but you gotta ask Mick that, I wish journalists would do so instead of asking the same old same old for the 382637th time

As i've written before, Angry is best understood as the narrator repressing
his anger in order to win acceptance. But at least the narrator knows what
he's doing, knows he's manipulating his target

(a great song, the only one i listen to from every show this tour.
when darryl's bass kicks in, it goes next level)

The situation is much worse on "Get Close". Here the narrator is a
completely lost soul begging for a miracle, imagining a woman that
will suddenly appear out of nowhere and love him to the depth of
her being. Its a pathetic stalker's theme song, its someone fantasizing
about the chick who lives down the hall who has not the slightest
interest in him

I'm beginning to like this album, i'm beginning to like what a
vicious takedown it is of the delusional among us. Again, very
much like Satanic Majesties, including the intentionally silly
(and optionally lenticular) cover art.

During the "A Bigger Bang" tour 2005/2006 they played 8 out of 16 songs from the new album, now they have played so far 6 out of 12...

Both 50%... hope they play some more, at least 2 more

Dreamy skies is the best song on HD

Rev, playing a song at a show isn't about what the song is about, 95% of concert goers don't even give a damn about the lyrics, let alone know them, all those casual fans probably just know the lyrics for Satisfaction and that's about it, playing a song live is about whether it works live, and after hearing it 4 times live, I gotta say that Angry does NOT work live well at all, but I already knew this when I first heard this song when it first came out because the tempo isn't right for them to play live and Mick's voice doesn't fit live...

not agreed obviously (about Angry)

but i do agree with you about how much better Mess It Up is live,
with all the added crunch

also, i just caught for the first time the onstage graphics for Sympathy,
the Stones fiddling while Rome burns (with little devils dancing on the ruins),
which fits very well with my current thinking about the overall theme of
Hackney Diamonds, and why they disguised their true feelings so well

no way would fans have accepted them telling the truth about things,
so they made art out of the sea of denial theyve had no choice but to
swim in. again, very similar to the sea of psychedelic beatlemania
they were forced to swim in in 1967

the madness of crowds

MiU is a song that needs to be played live...it's one of those songs that's way better live than on the record, like also Rambler e.g....Miss You for the first time in AGES is very enjoyable as well live this tour, before it sucked and I only liked the record version

I've been told by friends who were in the stands that the stage art they had for Sympathy was among the coolest they've ever seen, this almost made me regret that I've been in the pit all the time and didn't see much of the stage lol, but planning to get some of those seats by the B stage at least once next year when they hopefully come to Europe, seeing how I'd have a friend coming along then who doesn't always wanna be in the pit xD

Rev, what pray tell are the true feelings, in your opinion, that they disguised on HD? This is an honest question btw^^

r-w, i appreciate your interest, but you seem to be
repeatedly taking one of my hastily written imprecise
phrases out of context rather than considering that phrase
as part of the overall thought i'm trying to convey

but on the plus side your questions have given me a chance
to get clear in my own mind why the hell i feel so
differently about Hackney than the overwhelming majority
of Stones online fans

i really absented myself from this board for months
because i had nothing coherent to say about this mystery.
All i could say was "i'm not hearing what you people
are hearing, probably i will at some point, but for now
i dont enjoy it..."

and here i have to reference Satanic again. I lived
through that era, the album was a hit and praised,
everybody was dropping acid to it, but for me it
was a bridge too far, it was Beatles crap, and i
rejected it/them and went back to my first love, soul
music, motown stax etc, via which i had come to love
the music and atttude of the Stones.

of course it was not very long until JJF and Beggars
brought me back into the fold, forever.

the important point here is that Satanic was not
immediately rejected by the fans. That only happened
over time as a new conventional wisdom developed
that Satanic was a failed attempt to imitate the Beatles.
and that is the "wisdom" that has persisted, in most
quarters, right up until now.

so it took me about ten years to re-evaluate
Satanic and start to appreciate it, not as an imitation
of the Beatles but as, intentionally, both a homage to,
and a parody of, the Fab Four. There's some damn fine
Beatles music on Satanic, but the overall purpose was
to mock them and the mentality of the masses that
elevated to lofty heights such increasingly silly music.

So. revvy, what's being both parodied and respected on Hackney?
Generic stones music and the fans that insist upon it.
De-fanged inoffensive homogenized. Do y'all honestly
think Mick and Keith are happy about being muzzled
this way? well, yeah, to some extent, but only because
it pays well.

but their true feelings are clearly revealed in the lyrics,
utilizing vicious passive aggression. Just one "sincere" lie
after another. A river of denial. A cascade of fake emotions
and absurd ideas.

Because that's who we are as a culture, as a society
currently. as i keep saying, if the stones told the
harsh truth, the album would have been rejected.
"trendy, peter pan, blah blah blah"

I've written quite a bit about various of the Hackney
lyrics already on these pages, and if I feel inspired
i'll write more in the future. I was inspired to write
about "close to you" on this page because the proposition
was put forward that it was a beautiful sincere love song
when to me its obviously the fantasy of a disfuctional
incel who has not the slightest chance of making a
genuine love connection.

for now i can't do better than that at getting at
the truth about what they're really saying with
this album as opposed to what people think they're
saying.  y'all think they gave you the pleasant generic
album you demanded of them, but no, there's
quite a bit of shattered glass in the stew

(i forgot to add that for me it is not just the lyrics.
i think the music sucks, even after keith and andrew
performed extensive surgery on it. mick's lyrics
are generally brilliant at accurately reflecting the
value of the music being presented, mick's
lyrics tell me that he doesnt think anymore of the
music than i do. as does the fact that he's chosen
to perform only the songs i praised when the album
was released, plus "mess it up", which if it was a
rocker on the album instead of a bubblegum thing,
i would have praised as well since it explains why
they made such a vanilla album)

Voodoo Chile in Wonderland wrote on Jun 30^th, 2024 at 6:20pm:

now they have played so far 6 out of 12... Both 50%... hope they play some more, at least 2 more

True, but I do not regard the NYC club show in these stats...
its like including those one-offs from private parties for Mr Kraft or similar.
Pay me $6 million, I'll play whatever you want...lol

But 4 songs per show, not too bad, innt?
Up from 3 we saw in the first half of the tour!
Maybe an additional 1 more is to be seen...fingers crossed.

SSOH aside, Get Close and Dreamy Skies are standouts, for sure.
One of my Glimmer Twins had a party the last nite with a handful of her fellow HS grads...they all love
Dreamy Skies...played it 3 or 4 times, with no input from me...what clever folks we raised!!

Thanks for the long reply, Rev...if it seems like I' taking sentences out of the context it's probably just me being dumb and not understanding what you wanna express^^

Also the fact that you included some thoughts on Satanic Majesties here and the Beatles made me realise why I probably dislike the album so much...it's cause I don't like the Beatles much either, so that makes sense (yes I'm one of those Stones vs Beatles people lol even tho I know they all are friends, but it's about the music...the Stones imo are a rock'n'roll band, the Beatles were the world's first boygroup...)...I don't dislike it cause I was told by other fans to dislike it or something cause everyone started to dislike it over the years as you said but if that were the case I would dislike Dirty Work as well, cause many people seem not to be fond of it, but I enjoy it very much

Anyway, about what you said about Mick and Keith "being muzzled"...nobody is telling them what to write it's not like they are a new pop singer who is regulated by a record label, they write whatever the fuck they want...I think if some of the lyrics are falling a little flat and don't have the deepest meaning...e.g. the reason why Mick ended up not writing the lyrics for Angry he intended to but some boring stupid ones instead...is because he was throwing everything over and didn't have enough time and the lyrics were suffering a bit maybe...Andy Watt said Mick told him repeatedly that he couldn't write lyrics for a new Blues song since he had no time, so that's why they covered Rolling Stone Blues instead, because Mick had imposed that deadline on them and then probably didn't wanna divert again because he wanted to release that album...even if some lyrics ended up not being what he first might have intended them to be

But I agree with some lyrics not being what they seem to be...I mever thought Get Close is a beautiful love song...the beautiful but bitter-sweet love song on HD is Depending on You, it reminds me a lot of Streets of Love...Get Close...I wouldn't necessaeily have thought it was about an incel but someone who has been disappointed by love, actually...or maybe even something creepier, akin to Every Breath You Take, people also think it's a love song but it's about a stalker xD

Since we were talking about social commentary the other day...don't you think there is plenty social commentary in WWW? Mick says it's inspired by their early London days and I feel to a degree it's true but also it's a timeless song, it's clearly not really about the early 60s, I feel it also captures some of the spirit of the young generation in Britain (and the rest of the world) these days who are caught between the cost of living crisis and being all yolo cause we all won't get retirement pay anyway xD

"whole wide world" i've praised. cool power-pop-punk melody (i swear i've
heard the melody before, but if its micks or keiths or andrews invention,
it a great one)

but even www has this bitter pill at the end, which mick even emphasizes
more live. after lifting my spirits twice with the line "you think the party's over
but its only just begun" he finishes the song with a definitive "the party's over!"

unfortunately thats where i think we are. societally, culturally, the party's
over. hard times coming (obviously already here for lots of people)

see? i'm the same as everybody, i heard what i wanted to hear
"the party's just begun". thank you mick, i needed some good news.

but no, he insisted on sneaking in the truth at the end, and i was eventually
able to hear it

gotta go but...

1) c'mon r-w, i've already made this point several times. its not some
authority thats keeping the Stones generic and muzzled, ITS THE FANS !
the fans want the lies and are willing to pay for it. they are not willing
to pay for the truth

2) I'll try to remember to write soon about "depending on you"

WWW has one of those killer-riffs Keith has been talking about during the live stream with Jimmy Fallon and imo it's some of the coolest guitar parts in years, live it's also so much fun

And yeah you're right, I think that last line is easy to overhear when you aren't fully focused on the lyrics, but that of course was a sneaky move to put it in there at the end and he sadly isn't wrong...I still think if you mostly listen to the guitars it's a pick-me-up song tho, especially live^^

Also when it comes to interpreting lyrics on HD in general, I think none of the songs has more potential possible meanings than Tell Me Straight...and Keith also won't give an answer on wtf it is about, he was joking rather defensively on Howard Stern that it's about Fake News but I think that of all possible interpretations fake news is not among them...

I would love to hear your take on Depending on You!

Idk if it's truly the fans, seeing how 90% of fans don't even care about the lyrics, I mean hell, even I gotta admit that I don't understand all of the lyrics Mick is singing in JJF for example and I never truly bothered to look them up cause I just wanna hear Keith's guitar xD other songs tho I have spent LOADS of time on trying to interpret but I highly doubt that many do that, it's just some crazies like us here or over on IORR

1) My argument is about the album as a whole thing. The music, the cover
art, the hooks, the style etc.  I'm using the lyrics because thats where
Jagger explains whats really going on.

2) So I'm not claiming Satanic as an intentionally fake-ish album
because everybody was sitting around deciphering the lyrics. My
claim is that the whole thing was obviously in no small part a Beatles
satire, but people thought it was sincere. People of course ignored the lyrics,
but thats where the satirical intent was made clear

3) So Hackney is what it is. I can't argue with anyone who likes
the music. You like what you like. My argument is that, exactly like
with Satanic, that the album is not sincere. Its a satire of the
kind of socio-cultural musical and conceptual impotence that music fans
demand from the Stones these days. So that's what they gave you.
Vanilla all the way. If it was at all chocolate, y'all would have spat it out.

4) The music/lyrics of "depending on you" support this idea. As
background, please consider the 3 kinds of man blues: a) nobody's
really to blame, things just ran their course, who can say we
never tried b) i fucked up, i treated her bad, she's gone now, the
best woman i ever had c) i was so good to her, but all she did was
lie to my face and screw me over.

a) and b) are sad blues. c) is angry blues

the situation/lyrics in "depending on you" are c. the music is
completely inappropriately a/b sad/sentimental. Since when
are Mick Keith and the Stones sad when they get screwed over?
Mick Keith and the Stones get angry.

and one way to process their anger is to get a lot of money from
people who are willing to pay them to pretend that theyre not angry

this whole album is just one big lie. Because music fans are so gaslit
at this point, by the media, by their "leaders", even by their friends and
family, that the Stones have had to pretend that they are too, just like
they did on "Satanic"

All three together, maybe, plus  (e) and (f),  skipping out (d) and (g) but then jumping straight to (g) and (h) blues, Surely. to Dodd.

I guess they wouldn't play it because it's not a very good song

Why have they played stuff like Sad, Sad, Sad so often then? There are WAY better rotation songs, and way better songs on Steel Wheels...Get Close would be very interesting, musically, not only cause of Mick's voice and how amazing it sounds this tour but also the sax solo...they didn't play a song in ages that showcases the sax, maybe they would rather be inclined to play it if Bobby Keys was still with us but that is only a thought...

Also Rev I don't think we should be arguing about this any longer and abusing the thread like that because it's clear you have a very different way from interpreting songs than I do, I apprecciated reading your throughts even tho I don't share them and I would have a few points to get back about but let's just agree to disagree :P

God Sad Sad Sad is in my top ten awful stones songs along with Sparks Will Fly
Wanna hold you
Sweet neocon

I just looked up how many songs they played off of each new album since Steel Wheels during the first tour after each album was released:

Steel Wheels: 6 of 12 debuted in 1989 (Blinded By Love added in 1990)
Voodoo Lounge: 7 of 15 in 1994
Bridges to Babylon: 5 of 14 in 1997 (and 5 more in 1998)
A Bigger Bang: 6 of 16 in 2005 (This Place is Empty added in 2006)
Hackney Diamonds: 5 of 12 in 2024 (and Bite My Head Off at Racket gig)

Kinda surprising they played 10 of 14 songs of Bridges in total, then again that tour was incredibly long, wasn't it? Anyway what I wanna say by that it's astounding that they played so many songs off of that album when overall I think it's much weaker than HD is and they totally got at least 4-5 songs they could and should play during this tour or hopefully next year in Europe (Dreamy Skies, Depending on You, Get Close, BMHO, Live by the Sword)

Goo wrote on Jul 2^nd, 2024 at 12:20pm:

I guess they wouldn't play it because it's not a very good song

It's catching on...


https://youtu.be/hGfumtD2_Rw?si=XP9_k21Y-YlAwSpa

Honestly it's awful

It's awful cause this has gotta be the worst cover band I ever saw...I'm about 99% sure that if e.g. that cover band I saw last year who did SSOH and it sounded pretty good, played Get Close, we would be able to apprecciate its full potential, seeing how the Stones themselves won't give it to us for whatever reason  ::)

I'm talking about them btw:

https://youtu.be/R5vErlJ6JFw?feature=shared

Remember...

https://rocksoff.org/h5-wishlistmyass.jpg

Then the Olympic Games version

https://rocksoff.org/h5-wishlistmyassolympicslol.jpg

Warning: Recycled material content

Goo wrote on Jul 8^th, 2024 at 4:43am:

Honestly it's awful

It's taking off with our Asian fans..



https://youtu.be/XaDNvOLBOy4

Some Guy wrote on Jul 9^th, 2024 at 7:31pm:

Goo wrote on Jul 8th, 2024 at 4:43am: Honestly it's awful It's taking off with our Asian fans.. https://youtu.be/XaDNvOLBOy4

Except for the pronounciation which she obviously can't help cause she isn't a native speaker, that's not too bad tbh...it's unfortunate that we most likely won't get to hear this or Dreamy Skies from the Stones, the most likely other HD song they will still whip out for one of the last few shows this tour is BMHO but they already played it live once at the Racket, so we kinda know what to expect (except they surprise us by adding Macca as a guest)

Ronnie-woodie Why have they played stuff like Sad, Sad, Sad so often then?

Your  definition of so often would be completely different from my own. They’ve played Sad, Sad, Sad exactly 9 times in 34 years since the Steel Wheels Tour came to an end in 1990. Doesn’t sound like often to me. Sounds more like rarely played.

This is the ultimate destination of all the Stones songs (outside a few exceptions) from all their albums. After the tour is over, most are permanently retired or a few are very rarely played ever again.

Here’s my own experience. For a variety of reasons and close calls, was late to seeing the Stones live. Didn’t see them until 1981 during the Tattoo You Tour. Haven’t missed seeing them on their US tours since. They played 6 songs from the album (saw a 7th many years later Worried About You).
Steel Wheels - they played 6 songs at a couple of the shows I saw in 1989.
Voodoo Lounge tour in 1994- they played 6 songs
Bridges to Babylon 1997- they didn’t play as many so only saw  4 new songs
A Bigger Bang- saw them play only 4  despite seeing a number of shows
Hackney Diamonds- only 3 as Sweet Sounds of Heaven was on temporary hiatus

Those are 30 songs. If you missed the tours, most of those songs you ain’t ever going to see them live again. They’re permanently retired, gone forever. The ones that haven’t are very rarely played. Most of those songs were good songs to see live so from my point of view it’s a shame they don’t go deep more often but they’ve gone the Hot Rocks route on 66.

An added note in case anyone is interested (my guess is no one is  ;D).  Thru the years, they’ve also played new compositions to promote greatest hits packages (Doom and Gloom was one that was played for awhile).  These songs also have already suffered the same fate and have now been permanently retired. Years where I’ve seen at least one Stones concert: 1981, 1989, 1994. 1997, 1999, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2013, 2015, 2021, 2024.

My feeling of how often Sad, Sad, Sad has been played, was completely subjective then, because I didn't look it up before...but there clearly are way better songs off of Steel Wheels that they could play instead...they only played Mixed Emotions twice since 1990 btw and Almost Hear You Sigh exactly zero times since 1990, so idk why they keep Sad, Sad, Sad on the list, that was more what I wanted to express with my sentiment, that there clearly are way better songs they could put up but for whatever reason they won't...they last played Hand of Fate and Rip This Joint in 2003 for example, and Memory Motel last in 2013...I'd sure rather love to see them do another take on Rip This Joint now that Steve can give them a faster beat than get to hear Sad, Sad, Sad, which I love on the record btw, I like to work out to it, but I never thought it sounded that great on the live recordings

Also I know I'm lucky and I'm also grateful that I got to hear all 5 HD songs they have played so far this tour, and I also apprecciate that they switch Mess it Up and WWW, I even apprecciate they switch Miss You and Rambler even tho Rambler is my fave live song ever, the only "complaint" I have is that for some reason they play Angry all the time even tho it's not that great live, they could easily switch it up with BMHO or Get Close...

Sad sad sad is awful

Ok, then we'll save it for Europe...

Did we ever figure this out?

African chicks dig it; see below-

https://youtu.be/ok1sk9Ae0k4?si=CUBqushdP4Bh4nob

Yeah, that song is awful. The chorus is cringe worthy. It's got no feel the drumming sound of it very metallic. I don't like. Still better than sad, sad sad, and Sparks will fly

Awful?
Maybe it's too 'personal'/about someone who it would be unfitting to croon it about now (and that's why Goo feels dodgy about it). etc. Who knooows? Don't knock a minor classic, even it maybe falls down when there's (maybe) n insufficient beltage on it's trousers.

Honestly, it seems forced

here's a nice try- people are starting to get it

https://youtu.be/WWEjjlCNUfo?si=3bpN-fMevY29o55

Love it!

Here's how it's done. Damn, this should have been the first single with a kick-ass video of just the boys. Not too late...

https://youtu.be/OFhPjanyZio?si=fKsoTtQ1KXIGzHEX

Still digging this tune so much!!

YEP! It's a keeper!!

There's only one song I could do without on HD....its OK, but not up to par with the rest of HD IMO.
I wont mention it for fear of getting flamed by everyone, LOL