EXCLUSIVE: Live Nation and Ex-Chairman Michael Cohl at War Over Rolling Stones Tour

1/31/2011 by Eriq Gardner

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/sites/default/files/2011/01/108207697_c_l.jpg
George Pimentel/Getty Images

The battle between Live Nation and its ex-chairman Michael Cohl is heating up.

In November, the music giant sued Cohl for $5.35 million for allegedly breaching the terms of an agreement made at the time he left the company. Now Cohl has struck back, saying that it was Live Nation that first breached the very same contract by attempting to "interfere" and "destroy" Cohl's opportunity to procure promotional rights to a Rolling Stones tour later this year.

Cohl is famous in the entertainment business for his promotional endeavors. He is credited with inventing the modern rock tour and has recently gained much attention for producing Spider-Man: Turn off the Dark, the most expensive Broadway musical ever. In 2008, Cohl left Live Nation amid a feud with CEO Michael Rapino over the direction of the company.

When Cohl left in 2008, he signed a financial agreement that spelled out how exactly he would compete against Live Nation going forward. Cohl was to pay $9.85 million in installments to Live Nation in return for various assets, including a non-compete exemption to continue working with and promoting tours by the Stones, Pink Floyd and Barbara Streisand.

Live Nation sued Cohl for allegedly failing to pay $5.35 million in the 2008 agreement. But Cohl says that Live Nation never lived up to its side of the deal.

Last February, Live Nation sent Cohl a letter informing him that it was going to bid against Cohl for the Rolling Stones' next concert tour, which hadn't yet been announced. The company followed up with an e-mail stating that Cohl could still pursue the band's tour, but only through a joint venture. Live Nation also wanted Cohl to detail his negotiations with the Rolling Stones, which Cohl says would give Live Nation key info that could be used to undercut his own bid.

Later, Live Nation allegedly proposed competing separately for a Rolling Stones tour. Cohl says the proposal amounted to a breach of his contract with his former employer. Cohl says he paid Live Nation $20 million for the right to not bid against the company for the Rolling Stones tour, to have Live Nation finance the tour, to have Live Nation perform the services of "Executive Global Promoter" of the tour, and to receive two-thirds of the promoter's profits from the tour.

The Rolling Stones tour later this year is expected to be one of the biggest in concert history. It's the 50th anniversary for the band, which through the years has enjoyed a number of financially lucrative tours.

Cohl calls promotional rights on this upcoming tour "the crown jewel" of the agreement he made with Live Nation in 2008. He says the value of this asset would have more than accounted for the $5 million he owes the company. In other words, Cohl implies that Live Nation would have gotten its money if it hadn't  been the first to breach the agreement.

Cohl's countersuit also reveals that members of the Rolling Stones, including Mick Jagger and Keith Richards, have been informed by both parties of the "spat" and that they have expressed a desire not to get dragged into the middle of the dispute. But Cohl says the fuss is causing damage anyway. Live Nation has attempted to hurt his standing with the band's representatives, maintains Cohl.

A spokesperson for Live Nation wasn't immediately available for comment.

THR, Esq.

Might explain a delay in potential tour plans.
The band's waiting until the dust settles to see who'll offer the most guaranteed money.

'Course they could also let those parties feud on and solicit bids elsewhere, maybe even sans guarantee.

Riiiight...

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRPfA9W8j02RuIRcS_yqsVG2ZdvszOtxjsC2SIA9oysXZuz8t1c-gIdRn7lTg

I can almost hear Mick rubbing his hands together in anticipation as this one plays out.

" The Rolling Stones tour later this year is expected to be one of the biggest in concert history. It's the 50th anniversary for the band, which through the years has enjoyed a number of financially lucrative tours.

Cohl calls promotional rights on this upcoming tour "the crown jewel" of the agreement he made with Live Nation in 2008.  "


I am now so excited that I am typing this with me nipples .

Money talks ~ Bullshit walks! Whoever guarantees The Stones the most money wins! It's a bidding war, which IS a good thing!

Bitch wrote on Jan 31^st, 2011 at 8:25pm:

Money talks ~ Bullshit walks! Whoever guarantees The Stones the most money wins! It's a bidding war, which IS a good thing!

Money doesn't talk, it swears.  I think Bob Dylan said that as he assured his ma he was only bleeding.  I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm bled out.  Not a drop left. Sick of the greed.

Much ado about nothing. Cohl and Live Nation live in the same snake pit and are responsible in many ways for the outrageous ticket prices. Fuck yourselves to death I say.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/gonziggy/THE%20ROLLING%20STONES/ForbesStones1989.jpg

Bitch wrote on Jan 31^st, 2011 at 8:25pm:

Money talks ~ Bullshit walks! Whoever guarantees The Stones the most money wins! It's a bidding war, which IS a good thing!

Not for the poor bastards who are buying the tickets afterwards, it isnt...

And I used to think Ticketbastard was greedy...

When you die, you can't take it with you.

gimmekeef wrote on Feb 1^st, 2011 at 7:02am:

Much ado about nothing. Cohl and Live Nation live in the same snake pit and are responsible in many ways for the outrageous ticket prices. Fuck yourselves to death I say.

Yeah it's a lose,lose situation for fans. Neither one of the greedy bastards gives a shit about the fans....And frankly,neither do the Stones. :'(

steel driving hammer wrote on Feb 1^st, 2011 at 7:25am:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/gonziggy/THE%20ROLLING%20STONES/ForbesStones1989.jpg

What'll they do with all that money?  Hire new hair stylists!
Brainy

Does Keith still cut his own hair?

steel driving hammer wrote on Feb 1^st, 2011 at 11:02am:

Does Keith still cut his own hair?

If he can still do that, he can still play guitar !  :wtf1

Keith can play guitar w/ one finger! lol

Lawsuit Reveals Plans for Rolling Stones' 50th Anniversary Tour
The band's longtime concert producer is competing with Live Nation for promotional rights
Greetsia Tent/WireImage
Share77
By Matthew Perpetua
February 1, 2011 10:40 AM EDT
http://assets.rollingstone.com/assets/images/story/lawsuit-reveals-plans-for-rolling-stones-50th-anniversary-tour-20110201/1000x306/main.jpg

The Rolling Stones have yet to announce any plans to tour in the foreseeable future but a lawsuit involving the concert promotion juggernaut Live Nation and the band's longtime tour organizer Michael Cohl indicates that a 50th anniversary jaunt is in the works.

Photos: The Rolling Stones Live, 1964-2007

Live Nation is suing Cohl for $5.35 million for allegedly breaching the terms of the agreement made when he stepped down as chairman of the company in 2008. Cohl has responded with a countersuit which claims that it was in fact Live Nation that breached the contract with the intent to ruin his chances to attain promotional rights to an upcoming Stones tour.

Photos: Mick Jagger

Cohl's countersuit states that the members of the Rolling Stones are aware of the conflict between himself and Live Nation, but have elected not to get directly involved in the dispute. Nevertheless, Cohl believes that this rift is doing damage to his working relationship with the band, despite having produced every world tour they have gone on since Steel Wheels in 1989.
http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/lawsuit-reveals-plans-for-rolling-stones-50th-anniversary-tour-20110201

Gazza wrote on Feb 1^st, 2011 at 7:32am:

Bitch wrote on Jan 31st, 2011 at 8:25pm: Money talks ~ Bullshit walks! Whoever guarantees The Stones the most money wins! It's a bidding war, which IS a good thing! Not for the poor bastards who are buying the tickets afterwards, it isnt...

Yeah you make a good point, we're the ones who are going to end up paying the price! Ah well, its going to be the last time, 50 years, so I'm going to pay whatever it is, but I'll probably have to go to less shows, depending on how they space them apart, and choose the venues/seats with the lower prices.

Who's fighting and what for ?

Cohl will certainly not get any love here, besides that article makes the story hard to understand what's going on. Not the best way to start talking about that tour...

The main thing is we know a 50th tour is on the way.

Then again, so is my 72 custom Tele re-issue i ordered 3 frigging months ago!

nothings guaranteed.

Hey Mick....I'll do it for free!!!!!!!!!!..you can have all the money....Just let me handle the set lists and summit planning.

They should put off the U.S. leg til 2014.

Rolling Stones: 'We've got no firm plans to tour'

Band say they haven't locked down live dates for 2011

February 2, 2011

http://static.nme.com/images/article/RollingStonesPA051110.jpg

The Rolling Stones have said they have no "firm" plans to play live, following news of a potential new tour being made public via a lawsuit.

Yesterday (February 1) details of a suit between promoters Live Nation and the company's former chairman Michael Cohl revealed that a tour could have been on the cards.

Although they stopped short of denying that they would play live this year, the band released a statement saying no dates were confirmed. "The Stones confirmed today they have no firm plans to tour at this time," their spokesperson said.

Clarifying their association with the lawsuit, they added: "Following the end of the 2007 A Bigger Bang world tour The Rolling Stones became free from any contractual arrangements or agreements with Michael Cohl. He is neither their representative nor their tour promoter."

Cohl is countersuing against Live Nation, who filed against him in 2008 in relation to a contract between them. He claims the company attempted to "interfere" and "destroy" his bid to gain promotional rights to a 2011 tour.

Last November guitarist Keith Richards said the band were in fact likely to tour this year.

NME


The tour semi-denial isn't surprising, but imo that clarification reads like StonesCo trying to distance itself from Mr. Cohl...

Well there ya are people. There is the basic proof they want very much want to tour again. If they didn't .... Cohl and Live Nation wouldn't be suing each other over something that the band isn't willing or into anyway. The top dogs in these two organizations very much know The Stones are up for it and are ready to take on the task it seems. Now both groups want the privilege of promoting it. If The Rolling Stones weren't up for, and ready to plan a tour The two organizations, would see this as a case of ...."what tour?"... No use squabbling, gathering lawyers, going to court, and going through the legalities over something that isn't a reality and going to happen...

All the remarks about The Stones not wanting to tour anymore can thankfully be put to rest. They very much want to tour ... they are just waiting on the highest bidder or a winner in this battle... (gee ...the money they are wrapped up in....). I am not saying they are all saying .... we want to tour now and roll on continuously for the next 10 years if we can..." What I'm saying is The Stones are into a tour coming up... they will record an album ...and at the foreseeable future have absolutely no plans on retiring.

*When there were remarks about the band meeting and there being a "problem with 2011" this must of been it. It wasn't that they weren't into it.

I know many  here label me as a total optimist when it comes to The Stones. I know at times people think my enthusiasm overshadows reality. But it doesn't... nothing has pointed to them thinking about retiring. In fact, everything points to The Stones wanting to continue.

Lets face it folks, they don't need to plan a tour again. They are totally rich, respected, and have done it all three times over. They are in their mid sixties... yet still with all their millions they still are planning another tour. For what? They got loads of cash. More than any other active group. It isn't 100% about cash (only partially). If they wanted to settle down or do their own thing and let The Rolling Stones go they would of. If they didn't want to be The Rolling Stones anymore they would of stopped long ago. I mean they are loaded to the hilt and have nothing left to prove. They haven't for a long, long while. They WANT to continue.  Otherwise ....why bother ... again, ....and again, and again, .....and again.... and again... and here loaded to the max in their mid-sixties they are planning another one...

It's obvious. They have no plans in the near future on calling it quits. I know they really want to because ...why bother? Sure they will make loads of cash but geez ... they are loaded now and is it really worth a year or so on the road again, again, and again if you just arent that into it anymore?

To them ... they want to soldier on...


Ian

They'll walk from Cohl just as fast as they did Bill Graham if there's a nickel more to be had..........

I find it amazing that Cohl would have agreed to pay Live Nation $10 million so that they wouldn't compete with him to bid on tours of the Rolling Stones or Pink Floyd ! Pink Floyd, he can flush that down the drain now as for the Stones, that says a lot about the economy of music promotion, means there are only two names left...no wonder the ticket prices are crazy !

Ian Billen wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2011 at 1:53pm:

Well there ya are people. There is the basic proof they want very much want to tour again.

No..its basic proof that Cohl and Live Nation both want to promote one.

Lefty's summary of the statement is spot-on.

In a nutshell it's "if you think all this means we're about to tour, dont hold your breath"

It speaks volumes that most of the band's press releases in the last couple of years seem to be concerned with what they DONT plan to be doing in the near future (ie, Charlie's NOT leaving, they're NOT touring in 2010 and now they've NO concerts lined up)

Just reads of another case of some journalist running to Fran Curtis or someone like that to confirm a tour or something and she issues a non-committal statement, which is standard procedure until something IS confirmed.

According to Billboard's Ray Waddell - no band meeting planned, no tour bids being solicited: 

The Rolling Stones: We Have 'No Firm Plans' to Tour

by Ray Waddell, Nashville | February 02, 2011 5:20 EST

http://www.billboard.com/photos/stylus/101544-rolling_stones_617_409.jpg
Getty Images

Talk of a Rolling Stones tour this year has heated up in the wake of details from former Live Nation Chairman Michael Cohl's lawsuit against the company hitting the Internet. But Billboard sticks by its assertion that if the Stones were to tour it would probably not be until next year, or late this year at the earliest -- the Stones themselves basically squelched chatter about the tour via a statement issued today, without ruling it out completely.

"In light of recent reports surrounding the 'Breach of Contract' Court Case in America between Live Nation Entertainment and former Live Nation chairman Michael Cohl, The Rolling Stones wish to clarify their position regarding representation and touring," the statement reads. "Following the end of the 2007 'A Bigger Bang' world tour, The Rolling Stones became free from any contractual arrangements or agreements with Michael Cohl. He is neither their representative nor their tour promoter. Also the Stones confirmed today they have no firm plans to tour at this time.

"The Rolling Stones have recently secured a worldwide merchandizing agreement with Bravado Inc. and in 2008 signed a new global record deal with Universal Music," it adds.

Any squabbles between Cohl and Live Nation as to who would produce such a tour may be moot, as ultimately it's the Stones' call as to who steers the ship -- if the tour sails at all. Cohl led the band to unprecedented tour grosses with his dice-rolling financing, creative deals and market-value ticket prices, beginning with the "Steel Wheels" trek in 1989. But all of Cohl's tour deals with the Rolling Stones, which have grossed some $2 billion in ticket sales alone since 1989, were cut on a tour-by-tour basis, even if they included multiple rights such as DVDs and merchandising that extended beyond those tours' conclusion. Cohl became the Stones' guy because he and his team got the job done on all levels.

And even if the contract surrounding Cohl's exit with Live Nation apparently gave him the right to bid on a Stones tour, it certainly does not obligate the Stones to work with him.

Cohl worked with Live Nation promoters in various markets on some of his tours with the Stones, but before Live Nation existed he was able to secure financing from a variety of sources that bankrolled the massive startup costs a Stones tour requires. So he could likely get the job done without Live Nation, and indeed Live Nation could get the job done without Cohl and perhaps emerge as the favorite. Live Nation has an ace in the hole in dealing with the Stones, as LN Global Touring Chairman Arthur Fogel was a key executive under Cohl at the latter's former companies CPI and TNA before they became part of Live Nation.

Fogel has in fact become the leading mega-tour producer in the world, having steered with his Toronto-based team four of the five highest-grossing tours of all time, including U2's ongoing "360" tour. That tour will surpass 'A Bigger Bang' tour in April to become the highest-grossing tour in history, according to Billboard Boxscore. By the time "360" wraps July 30 at the Magnetic Hill Music Festival in Moncton, New Brunswick, the gross will be a staggering $700 million.

Those types of numbers surely will catch the eyes of the Stones' Mick Jagger and Keith Richards, who, by the way, tend to at least take a stab at new material before launching a tour, and sources say no band meeting has been called as of yet.

The list of promoters that could take on a tour of this magnitude is a short one, but longer than it was even a few years ago. Sources say Cohl, Live Nation, Paul Dainty, and AEG Live would be in the running for the next Stones tour, but it seems all these names surface in hopes that the band will tour, not because the band is soliciting bids. Fogel has his recent track record and strong history with the Stones, and though today's statement does not bode well, Cohl should never be counted out.

Even if Cohl is completely immersed in the beast that is "Spiderman: Turn Off the Dark," he tells Billboard that if the Stones came calling, "I always have time for the Rolling Stones."

Billboard

Gazza wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2011 at 4:17pm:

Ian Billen wrote on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 1:53pm: Well there ya are people. There is the basic proof they want very much want to tour again. No..its basic proof that Cohl and Live Nation both want to promote one. Lefty's summary of the statement is spot-on. In a nutshell it's "if you think all this means we're about to tour, dont hold your breath" It speaks volumes that most of the band's press releases in the last couple of years seem to be concerned with what they DONT plan to be doing in the near future (ie, Charlie's NOT leaving, they're NOT touring in 2010 and now they've NO concerts lined up) Just reads of another case of some journalist running to Fran Curtis or someone like that to confirm a tour or something and she issues a non-committal statement, which is standard procedure until something IS confirmed.

_____________________


I don't think they are about to tour, or that there are any "concrete" tour plans so to speak. Because there aren't. There is going to have to be a settlement and agreement of some sort. If you want my opinion I think The Stones, from a sponsored/promotional standpoint are in limbo right now. What I meant is I think they are definitely "planning" on touring either later this year, but most likely 2012. I think they are waiting to see how this plays out.

My point is that they are still remaining a touring/recording act and have no plans what-so-ever on retirement as was suggested. The plan is to tour ... not to stay at home and retire. This is what I meant. That is what they are aiming for is my point. Sure it may not come off until next year or late this year but the objective is to continue, not retire because all of them aren't into it anymore.

Suddenly there is a conflict on who is going to bid to promote a Rolling Stones tour. Why didn't this come up a year ago? Because they were not in talks of touring a year ago and now they are looking to do such is why. I am very sure The Stones or their representation spoke to Cohl and The Stones let him know they were certainly game. Otherwise .... why all the fuss over something The Stones aren't going to do anyway?

They had a band meeting .... then a short while after there is a conflict between promoters to be attached to a Stones tour. All within a six week period.

It only adds up...


Ian

Well the fuss is that Cohl didn't make a $6 million payment due to Live Nation because he argues that they broke their agreement not to bid against hime, namely that they told him in 2008 that they would bid on the next Stones tour. Apparently they wanted to co-promote a future tour but that fell through so he's saying they broke their side of the contract and he's not paying.

Why Cohl agreed to pay Live Nation $10 million to keep them out of bidding in the first place is a bit beyond me but I suppose it made sense to him at the time...in any case this problem would exist whether the Stones tour or not in the future, so no news for us either way.

Ian Billen wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2011 at 7:11pm:

Why didn't this come up a year ago? Because they were not in talks of touring a year ago... They had a band meeting .... then a short while after there is a conflict between promoters to be attached to a Stones tour. All within a six week period. It only adds up...

It did come up, and there were rumored talks.

Here's one report of the Stones entertaining bids last summer - Rolling Stones Said in Talks With Live Nation, AEG

Not sure what impact that'll have on your gazintas...

gotdablouse wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2011 at 7:32pm:

Well the fuss is that Cohl didn't make a $6 million payment due to Live Nation because he argues that they broke their agreement not to bid against hime, namely that they told him in 2008 that they would bid on the next Stones tour. Apparently they wanted to co-promote a future tour but that fell through so he's saying they broke their side of the contract and he's not paying. Why Cohl agreed to pay Live Nation $10 million to keep them out of bidding in the first place is a bit beyond me but I suppose it made sense to him at the time...in any case this problem would exist whether the Stones tour or not in the future, so no news for us either way.

Right,this is an argument between mega millionaires as to who will promote a group of mega millionaires and has been brewing for several years. In the end,this has little or no impact on the Stones abilty,or more importantly willingness to tour. I stick by my original theory. Their is only one person keeping the Stones from touring. :perverted :willya :warhorse

Ian Billen wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2011 at 7:11pm:

Suddenly there is a conflict on who is going to bid to promote a Rolling Stones tour. Why didn't this come up a year ago? Because they were not in talks of touring a year ago and now they are looking to do such is why. I am very sure The Stones or their representation spoke to Cohl and The Stones let him know they were certainly game. Otherwise .... why all the fuss over something The Stones aren't going to do anyway? They had a band meeting .... then a short while after there is a conflict between promoters to be attached to a Stones tour. All within a six week period. It only adds up... Ian

::)

Er..no it doesnt, for the reasons given above and because at the band meeting they DIDN'T agree on whether they would be touring again in the near future or not. THAT's a fact - not guesswork.


Ian Billen wrote on Feb 2^nd, 2011 at 7:11pm:

I don't think they are about to tour, or that there are any "concrete" tour plans so to speak. Because there aren't. There is going to have to be a settlement and agreement of some sort. If you want my opinion I think The Stones, from a sponsored/promotional standpoint are in limbo right now. What I meant is I think they are definitely "planning" on touring either later this year, but most likely 2012. I think they are waiting to see how this plays out.

this bit is pretty much correct - although I dont agree with the bits in bold. If the band wanted to tour,a  legal dispute between two potential promoters isn't going to delay it. There are other options available.

we're pathetic.

Some Guy wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 10:24am:

we're pathetic.

I :sad AGREE

That really hit home in the Bilboard article above


Quote:

Mick Jagger and Keith Richards, who, by the way, tend to at least take a stab at new material before launching a tour

that's all the interest a new Stones album raises these days...

From the Stones' official facebook page :

Some of you may have been made aware of the news stories concerning us touring and Live Nation. We wanted you to know directly that we have no current dealings with Live Nation and to date no news on touring. We can however confirm that you will be amongst the first to know if there is any tour news - watch this space!!

Wonder who updates that FB page, sounds a bit silly to say "we" but I guess that's part of the game.

No doubt the Stones have authorized someone to post those facebook updates.

They've also taken to twitter - Stones_dot_com

Mick's got an "official" account, too - Jagger_M

A tweet from today:
It'll contain news, competitions and updates from the site (launching very soon) and at times, messages direct from Mick.


Hmm. Maybe Mick'll post some twitpics from the Grammys...

The Stones on Twitter?

Is it just me or is there something not right about that?

Is one who "Twitters" considered to be a Twit ?

Yes, I have no doubt the people posting on the Stones FB accound are "auhtorized", obviously it's not one or the actual Stones, so it's a bit silly to say "we".

AngieBlue wrote on Feb 4^th, 2011 at 11:28am:

The Stones on Twitter? Is it just me or is there something not right about that?

It's all the rage.

Edith Grove wrote on Feb 4^th, 2011 at 11:49am:

Is one who "Twitters" considered to be a Twit ?

or a "twat" ?

gimmekeef wrote on Feb 4^th, 2011 at 2:48pm:

Edith Grove wrote on Feb 4th, 2011 at 11:49am: Is one who "Twitters" considered to be a Twit ? or a "twat" ?

No,that would be Lady Gaga ;D

sweetcharmedlife wrote on Feb 4^th, 2011 at 2:50pm:

gimmekeef wrote on Feb 4th, 2011 at 2:48pm: Edith Grove wrote on Feb 4th, 2011 at 11:49am: Is one who "Twitters" considered to be a Twit ? or a "twat" ? No,that would be Lady Gaga ;D

[smiley=thumbsup.gif]

Well, with U2 topping ABB by April, they better do something. One day, U2 WILL surpass them for tour grosses, but i want that to happen when the Stones are gone so i can say "Well, if the Stones were still around, that wouldnt happen".

I am pathetic too. :nanker

Gazza wrote on Feb 3^rd, 2011 at 7:02am:

Ian Billen wrote on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 7:11pm: Suddenly there is a conflict on who is going to bid to promote a Rolling Stones tour. Why didn't this come up a year ago? Because they were not in talks of touring a year ago and now they are looking to do such is why. I am very sure The Stones or their representation spoke to Cohl and The Stones let him know they were certainly game. Otherwise .... why all the fuss over something The Stones aren't going to do anyway? They had a band meeting .... then a short while after there is a conflict between promoters to be attached to a Stones tour. All within a six week period. It only adds up... Ian ::) Er..no it doesnt, for the reasons given above and because at the band meeting they DIDN'T agree on whether they would be touring again in the near future or not. THAT's a fact - not guesswork. Ian Billen wrote on Feb 2nd, 2011 at 7:11pm: I don't think they are about to tour, or that there are any "concrete" tour plans so to speak. Because there aren't. There is going to have to be a settlement and agreement of some sort. If you want my opinion I think The Stones, from a sponsored/promotional standpoint are in limbo right now. What I meant is I think they are definitely "planning" on touring either later this year, but most likely 2012. I think they are waiting to see how this plays out.   this bit is pretty much correct - although I dont agree with the bits in bold. If the band wanted to tour,a  legal dispute between two potential promoters isn't going to delay it. There are other options available.

__________________________

Not when Live Nation and Cohl are the two that will guarantee The Stones considerably the highest amount of money. If you think The Stones and their company is going to accept a smaller, less safe tour option we need to think about who we are talking about here. The Stones aren't going to settle for the "third" best option. They will gladly wait a year to make 100 million more dollars. They really do want to tour... but not at the expense of not maximizing the biggest package and going third rate. Seriously, without Live Nation or Cohl it's not worth The Stones time as they see it. All the the other promoting organizations are a level below all that. As far as Cohl I am quite sure he's spoke to Mick and I am very sure he knows The Stones willingness to do this. I'm sure he knows their stance on it and it's obvious they are wanting to do it but there are obstacles. Otherwise he wouldn't be giving two shits because they aren't up for it anyway. I can assure you he knows the personal viewpoints of the band and I'm sure he's spoke to at least Mick concerning their wanting to tour vs. not wanting to. . He knows The Stones are wanting to go on a major tour. Maybe not right away, but that's the next step for them as a band (besides making an album). Otherwise ...why all this fuss? Why a lawsuit? I'm sure he and Live Nation have other career ventures they would rather tend to than to waste time, effort, and cash on suing if The tour wasn't in the cards for The Stones. It's obvious they have no plans on retiring. They are just waiting for the best offer and/or the smoke to clear. If they were to attempt to tour right now/ legalities may get in the way or The promoters could get sued. Not a good situation for them even though they would still make money, they may suffer a bit in that area once lawsuits start being cast.

*In a major sense you simply can't blame them. Why? ... well they are The Rolling Stones. They don't take second place when it comes to touring. Never have, never will. They go the highest possible road in that sense. Been this way since 1969. In their eyes they are the ones who can command the most money and every single time they get it and set records. Their entourage revolutionized touring three times over (1969, 1981, and 1989). They are the old pros at it and the biggest major leaguers in this respect and have been forever. In their eyes .... why go third rate? Wait to see who the highest bidder is?

Would Donald Trump go third rate because the two top organizations offering the most cash are fighting at who gets to promote him? No. If you were the best at something for forty years and always commanded the most cash would you think about going grade C on a contract job?? Why should you? Your the one in demand and sooner or later you'll get your fat cookie form one of the grade A's. They want you bad and you are loaded to the hilt right now and not hurting in the least. Wait a bit for that much more dough...

This is all they are doing guys. They are planning on touring ... they are just waiting on the highest bidder, with no suing or legal cloud with the smoke cleared as opposed to risking alot and trying a third rate option at a much higher risk (especially in today's fragile financial economy).

**The delay isn't bc they aren't into it. The delay is they are waiting to see how they can maximize and make the most cashola "safely" ...without going third rate, making less money, in a riskier venture.


Clearly that's whats going on. ...


Ian

Michael Cohl may have invented the game but he isn't the only one who can play it.

If Live Nation and Michael Cohl are indisposed when the Stones decide to tour, it's not going to stop them.

Either they will find someone else to play the Michael Cohl and choose local promoters/venues on a city by city basis or even just go with AEG. They have been the sole promoter on a few high profile tours.

Look at this list

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AEG_Live

They can play a lot of AEG venues and use AEG to rent stadiums in some markets. Other than renting stadiums directly in maybe 5 US markets, you can book a whole tour off this list.

The thing is of course is that AEG doesn't have the same reputation for overpaying acts and losing money that Live Nation does.

ijwthstd wrote on Feb 7^th, 2011 at 12:30am:

Michael Cohl may have invented the game but he isn't the only one who can play it. If Live Nation and Michael Cohl are indisposed when the Stones decide to tour, it's not going to stop them. Either they will find someone else to play the Michael Cohl and choose local promoters/venues on a city by city basis or even just go with AEG. They have been the sole promoter on a few high profile tours. Look at this list http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AEG_Live They can play a lot of AEG venues and use AEG to rent stadiums in some markets. Other than renting stadiums directly in maybe 5 US markets, you can book a whole tour off this list. The thing is of course is that AEG doesn't have the same reputation for overpaying acts and losing money that Live Nation does.

________________________________________


Nice input. Still I must state some contrary. AEG's venues are arena's and large halls. A major Stones tour begs for many larger places and stadiums. As far as "renting" stadiums and such it becomes cumbersome, more risky, and adds many factors opposed to if Live Nation or Cohl were footing the bill. All those added steps and head aches wouldn't be necessary. Your concept is a great idea if there were no other high end options. However there are ... They can just record an album while simply waiting it out to see who comes out on top between Cohl and Live Nat. and take the winner for the big dollars in a straight ahead guaranteed payday. It would be uniform, they'd make more than with any other organization, and if it's Cohl, would be of familiarity.

I understand your concept. It's neat (although risky and much more cumbersome) but I don't think The Stones and their posse would take that route unless they were all out of other options. Right now, they still got the big boys fighting over them.

Regardless, nice idea and insightful thinking to this conversation... heck ... you ever thought about promoting? :)


Ian

Um....

AEG ARE the big guys.

They were the sole promoter of the last Britney Spears tour which was an arena tour nearing 100% capacity and over a hundred million gross. I know they have been the sole promoter of other tours but I am too lazy to look it up.

AEG subsidiary Goldenvoice stages the Coachella festival annually which is usually the #1 top grossing show in the United States. They own Staples Center in Los Angeles (where the Stones played twice on the Licks tour).

They stubbornly held on while Live Nation strove for and failed to reach total industry dominance. LN/CC original strategy was to buy out or drive all competitors out of business and achieve a monopoly, hence overpaying bands and outbidding competitors even if meant taking a loss.

There have been stadium shows long before Live Nation existed so booking them wouldn't a very complicated proposal to those with experience doing so.

Lawsuits of these types can drag out for years if neither party can come to a fast agreement. If the Stones decide to tour, they aren't going to wait for a resolution. There are other options available.

As far as promoting myself... nah, I can speculate based upon what I have read in the past and from talking to others but would never want to lay my own money on the line.

In today's economy and the Stones pricing strategy...I wouldn't want to gamble my own money either.....No doubt the reason there are no firm plans is the band do not like what promoters are offering as guarantee..so they wait and age.........

" Michael Cohl may have invented the game but he isn't the only one who can play it.

If Live Nation and Michael Cohl are indisposed when the Stones decide to tour, it's not going to stop them.

Either they will find someone else to play the Michael Cohl and choose local promoters/venues on a city by city basis or even just go with AEG. They have been the sole promoter on a few high profile tours.

Look at this list

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AEG_Live

They can play a lot of AEG venues and use AEG to rent stadiums in some markets. Other than renting stadiums directly in maybe 5 US markets, you can book a whole tour off this list.

The thing is of course is that AEG doesn't have the same reputation for overpaying acts and losing money that Live Nation does. "


This is great stuff me Stonesian Brother .


You are much loved by Joeykins

FWIW - likely not much - this blurb from today's Daily Mirror:  

Rolling Stones tour under threat after Mick Jagger and Keith Richards' 'todger' row

by Tom Bryant, Daily Mirror 9/02/2011

http://images.mirror.co.uk/upl/m4/feb2011/1/2/image-3-for-paper-pics-09-02-2011-gallery-838255753.jpg

Mick Jagger’s manhood has again come under the microscope – and this time it may have scuppered plans for a Rolling Stones tour.

Keith Richards repeated unflattering claims about the size of the legendary frontman’s “todger” last year – and the pair are no longer on speaking terms.

Insiders confirmed that lucrative plans for hitting the road this year have ground to a halt since the embarrassing jibes resurfaced last October.

The explosive interview with ­Richards quoted extensive passages of his autobiography, including how he referred to Jagger as “unbearable”, nicknamed him “that bitch Brenda” and said “Marianne Faithfull had no fun with his tiny todger”.

The guitarist, 66, was forced to apologise five years ago after making similar comments in an interview.

But in another chat last year, he said: “I’m sure that he’s had worse thrown at him by women. I mean, Jerry Hall pretty much decimated him anyway.”

A source said: “Mick read Keith’s book before publication and didn’t have any great problems with it.

“It was the fact that it was all dredged up in the interview afterwards that really upset him. Many believe this is the real reason why talks relating to the tour have broken down.”

The Mirror can reveal negotiations had reached the stage last year where venues were being discussed for dates this autumn.

But lines of communication have since broken down between various parties, with “tensions” within the band being blamed.

One source said: “Even before Keith’s comments, there was talk of various egos at play within the band which was making negotiations difficult. But the fallout from the interview seemed to be the final straw.

“The situation has not moved on at all. The prospect of touring in 2011 is looking bleaker and bleaker.”

Organisers are now trying to ­resurrect the tour for 2012 with London Olympic bosses keen for the band to open the Games.

Jagger, 67, will perform live at the Grammy Awards in Los Angeles on Sunday without his bandmates.

Last year Richards said they were definitely planning to hit the road again in 2011 – and dispelled rumours that the band had retired from touring. “Everybody’s ready to go out there again,” he said. “Who said it should stop, and who said when?

“Only we will know when it comes to an end, with a crashing halt.”

A statement issued on behalf of the band at the time said there were “no concrete plans” to go on tour.

And last week they said there were “no firm plans to tour at this time”.

The Rolling Stones’ last world tour earned £344million.


Daily Mirror

Well there ya are people. There is the basic proof they want very much want to tour again.

No knock, Ian - but does anybody out there want to put up a pie chart of the motives for another tour?

...Kids, more kids, grandkids
...Beat the Beatles, reputation-wise
...Pay off back debt
...Make back all the money lost touring before 1981
...Other?

Four months on from the publication of 'Life' and having read that Daily Mirror bollocks, it seems to me that there's only one way Mick can save face over all of this - and being the man that he is with an eye on what's trendy as well as on the financial markets, it could be something that could work to his advantage.

He's going to have to make a celebrity porno movie.

He could even re-use a Stones album title as well - 40 Licks, Sticky Fingers, A Bigger Bang, Stripped - maybe even Black and Blue if he can persuade Halle Berry to take part (might give me a reason to actually watch it)

Universal could give it an official release. The Stones' contractual obligations as far as 'new material' goes is all a bit vague and they could release this in time for the next tour and save the band going though the motions of making a new record. It would almost certainly sell more copies as well.

Like 'Shine A Light', there'll justifiably be complaints from certain parts of the fanbase that it was a) a nice concept made 30-40 years too late to be REALLY interesting and b) featured too many models instead of fans  but it's still better than nothing I suppose, even though I can't imagine I'll watch it too many times....

LMFAO!

Or a combo title -

She Stripped my Sticky Finger with 40 Licks

He'd just get a stunt todger. :P

Rolling Stones tour in doubt
Bang Showbiz
Wednesday, 9 February 2011
The Rolling Stones' latest tour is reportedly in jeopardy following a row over the size of Sir Mick Jagger's manhood.

The group's frontman is said to still be angry with his bandmate Keith Richards after he claimed in his autobiography and an interview last year that Mick had a small penis and plans for a new set of concerts have been put on hold.

Related articles

http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/music/news/rolling-stones-tour-in-doubt-2209056.html

---

Great - another article about it.

This is beginning to smell like a plant.  Like "Would You Let Your Daughter Marry A Rolling Stone?"

Cause you know there is no way this is going to keep the Stones away from a multi million dollar payday.

It's not really "another" article.

Several news outlets - including the one above - have parroted the gossipy piece in yesterday's Daily Mirror.

I hope the Stones don't end on such a small issue.

was a 2011 tour ever really going to happen?

I thought Keith's comment in the book even if in jest......struck me as being mean spirited and childish......Mick's waiting for the right deal to be cut financially. I would think Charlie would have taken umbridge at that shot too.

2012 tour will be named, the end of the world tour!

" The group's frontman is said to still be angry with his bandmate Keith Richards after he claimed in his autobiography and an interview last year that Mick had a small penis and plans for a new set of concerts have been put on hold.   "

<  ---- Do you REALLY believe that Mick Jagger is upset over something he has already outlived !!!!





Man  ,      .............. you SAID it Little Fella ( Lil' Fijikins )  .


Mick & Keef have already outlived their dicks so all that matters is the music [ read : money :) ]

It no big thin...........Now is it Mick. :blankfriggingstare1 Size don't matter never has never will.   :forfucksake
Now let's play some Rock n Roll!

Pdog wrote on Feb 10^th, 2011 at 5:28pm:

2012 tour will be named, the end of the world tour!

REM is the opening act?