I was wondering what your opinion is on It's Only Rock n Roll as an album? In my opinion there are a few good tunes on there... and certainly 1 ballsy classic (iorr the song itself) but otherwise I always found it sort of falling short.

It is no disappointment at all. Sure it's a "relatively" good album over all but I always thought it was a bit weak as far as on a "Rolling Stones scale".

Anyone?


Ian

you will not be greeted...

It's a very brave album. Whilst the world was heading into glam and double neck guitars, 20 minute drum solos and all sorts of associated crap, the Stones went "black". Starting with GHS & ending with B&B, IORR was part of a trilogy of funk and soul that the band had always liked, but never really dared to investigate. In "their own words", Charlie states how he and Mick would go to all the discos of the world in the 70's (well, Berlin, NY and London anyway) to hear the sounds the "kids" were into. Earth, wind and fire were stated as an example.

Also, the Stones were the old band even then. In U.K., Euro & Oz, "Glam" was huge. Not so U.S., but it was there. But also you had metal, hard rock and that awful country crap. Here in Oz, we our stuff smashing through via the pub scene with acts like Ac/Dc. The Stones had done all that, but went a totally different and original route than Zep, Who - or any white rock band really. That is, Stevie Wonder, Sly, Isaac Hayes & that whole post 71-72 blackploitation sound. We, white boys who wanted it turned up to 11 and wanted our rock stars in tight jeans, finged jackets and masses of curly hair, maybe didnt get it. The albums still sold, but they lost a bit i reckon. A bit of a connection with their audience. But, they were brave i say.  It's an interesting period for sure.

Hard to compete against double neck guitars and 20 minute drum solos.

I can honestly say that IORR is in my top five favorite Stones albums. The blending of soul, funk, and rock 'n roll made that record. To some, it may sound dated for that blending of styles, but I have always enjoyed that record.

Distinctly average

corgi37 wrote on Feb 7^th, 2010 at 4:11am:

It's a very brave album. Whilst the world was heading into glam and double neck guitars, 20 minute drum solos and all sorts of associated crap, the Stones went "black". Starting with GHS & ending with B&B, IORR was part of a trilogy of funk and soul that the band had always liked, but never really dared to investigate. In "their own words", Charlie states how he and Mick would go to all the discos of the world in the 70's (well, Berlin, NY and London anyway) to hear the sounds the "kids" were into. Earth, wind and fire were stated as an example. Also, the Stones were the old band even then. In U.K., Euro & Oz, "Glam" was huge. Not so U.S., but it was there. But also you had metal, hard rock and that awful country crap. Here in Oz, we our stuff smashing through via the pub scene with acts like Ac/Dc. The Stones had done all that, but went a totally different and original route than Zep, Who - or any white rock band really. That is, Stevie Wonder, Sly, Isaac Hayes & that whole post 71-72 blackploitation sound. We, white boys who wanted it turned up to 11 and wanted our rock stars in tight jeans, finged jackets and masses of curly hair, maybe didnt get it. The albums still sold, but they lost a bit i reckon. A bit of a connection with their audience. But, they were brave i say.  It's an interesting period for sure. Hard to compete against double neck guitars and 20 minute drum solos.

Great analysis. ... I never really thought of those albums in that context of pre-disco black innovation. Springsteen found his own way out of the cul-de-sac of prog-rock, but the Stones, arguably, at least tried to push boundaries.

Not to take too much away from Corgi’s fine analysis, but I cannot help but feel that his opinions and observations are partly based on being there at the time. Been born nine years after the said albums release, I have the benefit of hindsight – and I stick by my earlier posting: a distinctly average release. IMO, it’s the boys at their most MOR and boring. Very little excites me about this release. The production is so sugary, it gives me a headache. The finer moments of Black & Blue – and that’s not a great release, either – surpass those found on IORR.

i don't find this record weak in the least.  i find it much more interesting than Undercover.  Luxury is one of my all time faves

:areyoufuckingserious

I think it's one of the "Stonesiest" Stones albums - Time Waits and Fingerprint File are the only really different songs.  And of those really Stonesy songs, I especially enjoy Dance Little Sister, Short and Curlies, and the two ballads.  HTM, I can't see much that's MOR other than Till The Next Goodbye maybe, and it's MUCH better than Black and Blue - their weakest album outside of the modern era.  To each his own; I could never get into B&B.

It's the weakest of the Taylor era and no where near as good as GHS.

If it had the production values and sound of Sticky its a different story. Personally haven't played this album in over 20 years.

I don't listen to IORR very often, but it has my two favorite Taylor studio solos on it.

Time Waits For No One and If You Really Want To Be My Friend.

corgi is doing a good thing, by looking st it from the time it was made and not from a 30 years ago perspective...

:smilestu   The era of junk music.

I think it's a pretty good record, that (like GHS, which is IMO a weaker record) merely suffers from being compared to what had been a very high standard of releases in a short period of time. Obviously that couldn't go on for ever, and at a time when the Stones were putting out a new album every 12-15 months or so, something had to give. These days we're lucky to get an album every 12 years, let alone 12 months.

After Jimmy Miller had burnt himself out with GHS, this was the first 'Glimmer Twins' production, so I guess they were still finding their feet a bit and it shows, slightly.

I've never cared for 'If You Really Want To Be My Friend' for some reason and 'Short & Curlies' raised a smile on the first listen and became 'skip' material soon afterwards - neither of them are out and out turds, though.

There's still some moments of magnificence, though - marvellous interpretation of 'Aint Too Proud To Beg', the funktastic 'Fingerprint File', the 'impossible to keep still to''Dance Little Sister' (a song which Pdog has often and correctly insisted would work superbly on a b-stage), 'Luxury' (which somehow works beautifully despite Mick's faux-Kingston patois) and that coda on 'Time Waits For No One', marking Taylor's glorious swansong to his Stones' career.

The title track is a marvellous 'accident'. At some point, the drums and guitars seem to become slightly out of synch with each other and in the last couple of minutes it sounds like it could fall apart at any time. Somehow or another, it works. In many ways it's become a bit like 'Miss You' . The fact that its been overplayed in concert without ever coming close to capturing the brilliance of the studio version has led to it being underappreciated by diehards.

IORR is one of the Stones' most underrated albums, in my opinion. I listen to it all the time. "Time Waits For No One" is one of their most beautiful songs, lyrically and musically. Mick Taylor's guitar and Nicky Hopkins' piano near the end are sublime. "Till the Next Goodbye" and "If You Really Want To Be My Friend" are two of the most outstanding vocal performances by Jagger on record, and the song "IORR" was an instant classic.

It rocks, it rolls, it swoons, it moans. It does everything a Rock and Roll record should.

How can you not love this track listing:

If You Can't Rock Me  
Ain't Too Proud To Beg  
It's Only Rock'n'Roll (But I Like It)    
Till The Next Goodbye  
Time Waits For No One
Luxury
Dance Little Sister    
If You Really Want To Be My Friend  
Short And Curlies  
Fingerprint File

"it's a pretty good record, that (like GHS, which is IMO a weaker record) merely suffers from being compared to what had been a very high standard of releases in a short period of time. Obviously that couldn't go on for ever,"

:retarded

It was better than Bad Company ... Diamond Dogs & Berlin which were a cut above at the time ...

CrissCrossMind wrote on Feb 7^th, 2010 at 8:58pm:

"it's a pretty good record, that (like GHS, which is IMO a weaker record) merely suffers from being compared to what had been a very high standard of releases in a short period of time. Obviously that couldn't go on for ever," :retarded It was better than Bad Company ... Diamond Dogs & Berlin which were a cut above at the time ...

Well, I was comparing it to other Stones albums.

As far as other artists go, definitely better than Bad Company, not quite as good as Diamond Dogs and nowhere close to Berlin  (Lou's masterpiece IMO) - although 'Berlin' came out around the same time as Goats Head Soup - the Lou Reed album that was a contemporary of IORR was 'Sally Can't Dance', which was a turd.

'74 was a bit of a quiet year for the major rock artists at the time, in hindsight. Zeppelin, The Who and Pink Floyd were in between records, Springsteen (although he was only a cult act at the time and didnt break until '75) was still making 'Born to run',  Neil Young had peaked commercially, although 'On The Beach' was still a great record and Dylan released 'Planet waves', which was a minor return to form.

Gazza wrote on Feb 9^th, 2010 at 6:28am:

and Dylan released 'Planet waves', which was a minor return to form.

Back with the Band ... "Tough Mama." I need to play that *right now.*

Planet Waves must be Dylan's most underrated album.

Back to topic. I don't find IORR weak at all. I'm a bit of a cliche Stones fanatic: I dig the Big Four and Some Girls the most, but IORR is among the best of the rest for me. Dance Little Sister and If You Can't Rock Me are great party tunes. IORR, Short And Curlies, Fingerprint File and Time Waits For No One are classics..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBU1gDNGlYM

I would say that It's Only Rock 'n' Roll is a good album, but nothing more than that. If You Can't Rock Me is always a good listen, but it's the first song that can really be classed as The Rolling Stones impersonating themselves (songs that followed on in this tradition include You Got Me Rocking and Rough Justice). The highlights are Time Waits For No One, the title track and Fingerprint File. A lot of the other songs are pretty average and Luxury is fucking awful. It's better than Black & Blue, I suppose, but not as good as Goats Head Soup.

One of the highlights is a pretty strong Mick Taylor presence, which, considering it was his last album with The Stones, makes sense. Of course, It's Only Rock 'n' Roll (But I Like It) hints at Ronnie Wood replacing him already. It's pretty historical for The Stones, but not one of their finer efforts.

Wow. so many here like IORR as an album. Don't get me wrong ...I do "like" it so-so. It's just a bit weaker per say in my book compared to even later works (VL, BTB, ABB) and certainly their total classics (BB, LIB, SF, EOMS, SG etc.).

I like GHS much better. While GHS may not be so commercially successful or the best they've done as far as a top notch Stones classic....I do enjoy GHS the very most as my "personal favorite".


Interesting. I am surprised so many here regard IORR, Emotional Rescue, and Black and Blue so highly. I never really have.

Thanks for the input.


Ian

Absolutely not weak.  As good in its way as Tattoo You, or better.  It's the link between Sticky Fingers and Tattoo You - they've always struck me as three attempts to create and sequence the same album over time.

Three highly underrated ballads, several striking rockers.  Even the wank tune "Short 'n' Curlies" is better than, say, "Benny the Bouncer" by ELP - their version of a wank tune.  There's so much to say about this record that I'm free-associating new stuff because I haven't got hours to say the old stuff.

I have decided after many years of equivocating to just go ahead and say it:  Goats Head Soup is my favorite album, ever.  It beat out other headphone classics like Astral Weeks.

Ian Billen wrote on Feb 9^th, 2010 at 11:26pm:

Wow. so many here like IORR as an album. Don't get me wrong ...I do "like" it so-so. It's just a bit weaker per say in my book compared to even later works (VL, BTB, ABB) and certainly their total classics (BB, LIB, SF, EOMS, SG etc.). I like GHS much better. While GHS may not be so commercially successful or the best they've done as far as a top notch Stones classic....I do enjoy GHS the very most as my "personal favorite". Interesting. I am surprised so many here regard IORR, Emotional Rescue, and Black and Blue so highly. I never really have. Thanks for the input. Ian

I like pretty much all their studio albums. The only two sub-par ones in my eyes are Satanic Majesties and Dirty Work - both recorded under pretty trying circumstances within the band, and which didnt work because in one case the Stones were trying to be something they weren't and in the other case, because Mick Jagger's input was minimal. Even at that, both albums have some good songs and aren't TOTAL write-offs - they're merely bad STONES albums.

Oddly enough, despite their reputation as a great live act, its their in-concert albums which make up the bulk of their most unsatisfactory releases. Most of them I rarely listen to.

I wish I could say the same Gazza. Up to 1994 I'm with you (I actually think DW and TSMR are quite good, though), but I really don't like the last two albums, a few songs on B2B aside. I like giving the live discs the occasional spin. Ya-Ya's and LYL are my favorites but I suppose that's obvious.

Ok maybe it's average for the standards of the Stones, but still one of the top 30-40 albums if 1974 anyway. And not even a weak Stones entry (those would, to me, be Dirty Work, Undercover and Emotional Rescue). "If You Can't Rock Me" is pretty generic and would've barely made B-side for the same band in 1969. Christ, unreleased stuff from that era was better when it showed up on Metamorphisis. But as the era went for the Stones, some ballads were just ok filler- for instance, "Till the Next Goodbye." The title track's a good old singalong but nothing essential or mind blowing at all. Pretty formulaic in its description of rock formulas. That said, glam rock (petering out about 1974) was just that and the Stones smoked 99% of those ponces even on "IORR." "Time Waits for No One" may be all witchcraft and stardust before Stevie Nicks ever got really into that but it's totally redeemed by a lovely chorus and Mick Taylor's guitar pyrotechnics.

"Luxury" is pretty average, while "Short and Curlies" and "Dance Little Sister" are probably the laziest things on the entire album. But I like the raw enthusiasm behind "Ain't Too Proud to Beg" and "Fingerprint File" is a sweet funky finale. Now many find "If You Really Want to Be My Friend" boring, but it's one of my favourites on the album and one of my favourite post-Exile songs, specifically amongst ballads. It captures the lonely, soulful blues of "I Got the Blues" but better, plus who doesn't love that flanger guitar bit? Mick T. also rip roars on it with soloing while Mick J. puts in one of his all-time best vocal performances. It's over 6 minutes but not a second wasted, really driven home at the end especially. IORR feels like an album where the Stones were feeling out other genres, sometimes not really trying with their bread and butter and yet coming up with gold every once in a while. It's less hit-or-miss than B&B- IMO the superior record for its much more vicious rocking side recaptured- though not as striking as GHS. Verdict: B+ (Good but nothing more, nothing less).

Prodigal Son remains the Robert Christgau of Rocks Off...... [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

So am i Charles Shaar Murray?

Gazza wrote on Feb 11^th, 2010 at 6:41am:

Prodigal Son remains the Robert Christgau of Rocks Off...... [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

HURUMFF!!!

Anybody that can't still be knocked out by the GHS - IORR - BnB trilogy needs a new band.

corgi37 wrote on Feb 13^th, 2010 at 7:36am:

So am i Charles Shaar Murray?

No. You're Paul Cashmere.....

Paranoid Android wrote on Feb 13^th, 2010 at 9:07am:

Gazza wrote on Feb 11th, 2010 at 6:41am: Prodigal Son remains the Robert Christgau of Rocks Off...... [smiley=thumbsup.gif] HURUMFF!!!

I said Christgau because he likes his A, A-, B ratings system.

You can be Lester Bangs.